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Will my TT design work

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Koi38
Senior Member

Jan 15, 2006, 1:48 PM

Post #26 of 55 (4770 views)
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Re: [koi@kit] Will my TT design work [In reply to]	Can't Post

yoo kit,

Glad we have the same Tongue

is yours running yet...........do you mind sharing it with us Wink

rgds,
Jon

"DuKu Friendly"
_____________________________________
"No one is ever too old to know better"

http://s3.photobucket.com/albums/y63/Koi38/

koi@kit
Senior Member

Jan 15, 2006, 4:58 PM

Post #27 of 55 (4759 views)
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Re: [Koi38] Will my TT design work [In reply to]	Can't Post

yoo koi38..

nope. bot it n left it near my pond.. dont know wat to do with it yet.. might copy ur design.. Wink

.. my DIY is always "VERY slow n steady".. hahahhahhaahahahaha

drcheang
Koi Lover

Jan 16, 2006, 3:37 AM

Post #28 of 55 (4744 views)
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Re: [Koi38] Will my TT design work [In reply to]	Can't Post

Trying to think of what I could use for settlement now.

Hi John,
Is ur pond has no bottow drain? It that why u cannot have a settlement tank? If thats the case I can suggest this. U can have a settlement tank or even a vortex as a prefilter B4 the water pass through the TT. Get 4 pieces of 4" PVC pipe, 2x L connector and a straight connector. Also get to end cap for the PVC pipe. Connect the PVC pipe to form a U shape with the middle part connected by using the straight connector. Cement the L connector but leave the straight connector free moving. U now can sifon the water from the pond to the settlement tank using this pipe. Trick is that cover one end of this U shape with the end cap and turn the u shape pipe now 180 degree upwards. U will now form a step ladder shape pipe. Fill up the pipe with water and cover the upper end with the end cap. Turn it back into U shape and put one end in the pond and another end in the settlement tank. Release both end cap at the same time and the water will flow from the pond to the tank via sifon effect. It is now almost like a bottom drain for U...... I will post some picture in the morning after I take the picture. It is 3.00 am now.
U must use a prefilter cos ur spray bar will be block in 1 week if without a prefilter. Trust me. I been through it!!!!!
I will put up some pic together with a vortex,prefilter and TT in the daytime.(All DIY)
Cheang

koineedtoknower
Koi Lover

Jan 16, 2006, 9:58 AM

Post #29 of 55 (4738 views)
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Re: [drcheang] Will my TT design work [In reply to]	Can't Post

Yes please some pics, I was with you up until the end and then got a little lost, and yes i do not have a bottom drain. I have a simple picture drawn of what I was thinking of doing want to know if it would work as a settlement it is at the following link TT with settlement sorry about the size the setllement is on the left and the water a few unches above the bottom and then flows up and exits the top right side to the TT.

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1 bekko, 1 sanke, 1 showa, 1 yamabuki ogon, 2 platinum ogons, 1 asagi, 1 orenji/yamabuki ogon, 1 buttefly kohaku, 2 kujaku, 2 shubunkins, 3 comets, 1 sarassa comet, 3 feeder fish, 2 kivers, 1 catfish.

drcheang
Koi Lover

Jan 16, 2006, 2:37 PM

Post #30 of 55 (4727 views)
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Re: [koineedtoknower] Will my TT design work [In reply to]	Can't Post

This are the pictures
This pic show the pipe from the pond to the vortex. U can straight to any settlement tank. For the Sifon to work u must make sure no air is trap in the paip. Water will flow from the pond to outside even over the edge of the pond until the water level is the same between the tank n the pond.

(This post was edited by drcheang on Jan 16, 2006, 2:46 PM)

Attachments:

sifon.jpg (95.4 KB)

drcheang
Koi Lover

Jan 16, 2006, 2:45 PM

Post #31 of 55 (4716 views)
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Re: [drcheang] Will my TT design work [In reply to]	Can't Post

This pic show the vortex connect to the settlement tank which i put in Jap mat to filter off fine particle. The pump is in this tank. From the pump the water is pump up to the TT and via a T connector to the UV and protein skimmer. I need UV here cos is 365 days of sunshine n i do not shade the pond. The onli shade the fish gets is from the water plants. The UV is on for 6 hours onli per day. Water is crystal clear.

(This post was edited by drcheang on Jan 16, 2006, 2:49 PM)

Attachments:

vortex and filter.jpg (94.7 KB)

drcheang
Koi Lover

Jan 16, 2006, 2:51 PM

Post #32 of 55 (4709 views)
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Re: [drcheang] Will my TT design work [In reply to]	Can't Post

Heres is how I DIY my spray bar.

(This post was edited by drcheang on Jan 16, 2006, 2:54 PM)

Attachments:

spray bar.jpg (95.0 KB)

drcheang
Koi Lover

Jan 16, 2006, 3:00 PM

Post #33 of 55 (4705 views)
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Re: [drcheang] Will my TT design work [In reply to]	Can't Post

This is the pic of the TT. I use the container like u guys suggested n 900 Bio Balls, 6 kg of Lava rock( here cannot get lava rock. it is more expensive then the bioballs here), 6 kg of ceramic ring. I cover the top with liner. I took it off just to take pictures. This type of container close by the side. So no worry of losing water to the side. U can also use beer bottle container for this. The flow rate for the TT is 4000L/hour. My pond is 2000L onli.

Attachments:

tt.jpg (97.4 KB)

drcheang
Koi Lover

Jan 16, 2006, 3:09 PM

Post #34 of 55 (4701 views)
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Re: [drcheang] Will my TT design work [In reply to]	Can't Post

This is the pic for the water return. I have not come out any idea to make water return more estatic yet. The duck is water return from the UV/Protein skimer. I may make a bigger pond next year after my son grows up. Now onli 2 feet deep Unsure

. I do not want the pond too deep now for the safety of my son Mad

. U can see that water is crystal clear. I took the pic at 2.00pm just now. Ok.. that all. John if got any question u can ask me. All the pic I show u is DIY. (but is the work of almost 2 years)

Attachments:

pond.jpg (94.3 KB)

larz1
Koi Kichi

Jan 16, 2006, 10:51 PM

Post #35 of 55 (4691 views)
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Re: [Koi38] Will my TT design work [In reply to]	Can't Post

In Reply To

Hi John,

These what I'm going to use on my TT. Got it yesterday for $2 each, stackable too Wink

. Too good to missed Cool

These will hold 400kg of Lava rocks or bioballs even 200kg of BH will fit Cool

rgds,
Jon

You Bargain Shopper You Cool

. You should get great flow and degassing with those crates!

koineedtoknower
Koi Lover

Jan 17, 2006, 1:53 AM

Post #36 of 55 (4689 views)
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Re: [drcheang] Will my TT design work [In reply to]	Can't Post

Thank you cheang, very nice setup you have. i am wondering how do did you match the rate the sifon puts the water out and the pump flow rate? If they are not then wouldnt the sifon stop working once it hit the waterlevel and then pump would dry out? Or is does your pump just pull out enough where it doesnt drain it but it pulls out enough to stop it from filling to the top which causes the sifon to put out more water? this just kind of confuses me, hope my questions arent confusing Crazy

. My main question I guess would be do you need to match the pump rate with the water sifons rate? and if not then does the pump need to be fast or slow?
Thanks

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1 bekko, 1 sanke, 1 showa, 1 yamabuki ogon, 2 platinum ogons, 1 asagi, 1 orenji/yamabuki ogon, 1 buttefly kohaku, 2 kujaku, 2 shubunkins, 3 comets, 1 sarassa comet, 3 feeder fish, 2 kivers, 1 catfish.

Koi38
Senior Member

Jan 17, 2006, 9:28 AM

Post #37 of 55 (4681 views)
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Re: [larz1] Will my TT design work [In reply to]	Can't Post

G'day Larry,

Long time no hear, must be got out of hibernation Tongue

Just got lucky with those crates. Some ppl look at them as waste but for koi keepers they can do wonders Wink

rgds,
Jon

"DuKu Friendly"
_____________________________________
"No one is ever too old to know better"

http://s3.photobucket.com/albums/y63/Koi38/

drcheang
Koi Lover

Jan 17, 2006, 9:29 AM

Post #38 of 55 (4681 views)
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Re: [koineedtoknower] Will my TT design work [In reply to]	Can't Post

Dear John,
Sifon effect is physics. The surface of water have atmosferic pressure. The atmosferic pressure will push the water from the pond via the pipe into the settlement tank n in my case the vortex. Try this:- find a rubber hose n put one end into a pail full of water. Suck on the other end till water comes out. U will see that the water will flow as long as the outer end is at lower level then the water level in the pail. The flow rate of sifon is determine by the size of the pipe, the difference of water level on both end. First when u put the tank at the same level with the pond. Put in the sifon n water will flow from the pond to the tank till it is at the same level.Cos now the atmosferic pressure is the same on both side. So now u put the pump in the settlement tank n pump the water out. Once the water level drops in the settlement tank, water will flow from the pond to the tank. Few things u must know. There must be no air in the pipe. Thats why the connector in the center n using end cap. The center connector will allow u to turn the pipe into the pond n release the end cap after u fill the pipe with water. If u r pumping at rate 1000GPH u need a 4" pipe. The pic I show u has an example of the end cap in the vortex n the sifon pipe u can see the center connector. I m using 2" pipe onli n flow rate of 1000GPH is doing fine. Not too many twist n turn of the pipe in the pond too as this will slow it down. This is a simple solution for all pond without a BD n wants to gravity feeds water to a tank B4 pumping to TT, waterfall,biofilter etc.

koineedtoknower
Koi Lover

Jan 18, 2006, 3:53 AM

Post #39 of 55 (4662 views)
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Re: [drcheang] Will my TT design work [In reply to]	Can't Post

I understand how that works, because my dad does it every now and then to drain our hot tub. My question is what size pipes will I need for a 5000gph pump, would I need two 4" pipes? Also would it be ok if I have where the water flows to from the pipes be the settlement tank but have it flow up to to a pipe leading to another container with the pump in it of course all lower than water level. The only problem i see is my TT is on the left side of my pond and the sifon would have to be on that side to keep the u driectly to settlement, but the problem is my water return is on the left side of the pond so should I be worried about mainly cycling the same water over and over? Would a pump on the other hand pushing water towards it help? That should it be it, thank you.

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1 bekko, 1 sanke, 1 showa, 1 yamabuki ogon, 2 platinum ogons, 1 asagi, 1 orenji/yamabuki ogon, 1 buttefly kohaku, 2 kujaku, 2 shubunkins, 3 comets, 1 sarassa comet, 3 feeder fish, 2 kivers, 1 catfish.

drcheang
Koi Lover

Jan 18, 2006, 5:10 PM

Post #40 of 55 (4644 views)
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Re: [koineedtoknower] Will my TT design work [In reply to]	Can't Post

Dear John,
I think u may need two 4" pipe. If u want to sifon from one end of the pond n return on the other end, very simple. Just put the settlement tank on the side u want to draw water. U may put multiple tank n put sifon pipe between the tanks. I used to have 2 tanks with only sifon between them. Onli the pump in the final tank n pump it to anywhere u want. U may lose some flow due to the long distance the water need to flow from the pump to the TT. It is better then recycle the same area of water.. Also do keep the sifon simple so that it can keep up. As the sifon is passive n pump is active, better pump far then sifon far. There may be fifference of water level between the tank n the pond but if the tank is deep enough is OK.. I hope it answer all ur question. BTW I use one 2" pipe for 1000GPH without problem. So 5000 GPH with even one 4" pipe I think will be OK.
Cheang

(This post was edited by drcheang on Jan 18, 2006, 5:13 PM)

koineedtoknower
Koi Lover

Jan 19, 2006, 4:07 AM

Post #41 of 55 (4625 views)
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Re: [drcheang] Will my TT design work [In reply to]	Can't Post

Yes thank you cheang, you have helped greatly. I think I may put a sifon, of just a 4" pipe at first to test if it is enough, at the far end of the pond farthest from waterfall, the sifon will go into a tank which will upflow into another smaller tank, the pump will be in this tank and will pump to tt, on top of first tank will put a little matting to help catch some smaller debris that didnt settle. I think i will try to find a decently large container and bury most of it underground so only about a foot and a half to 2 feet will be above ground and the second small container will be only somewhat underground. Sound good? I definitely like your spray bar Smile

, will try to make something like that.

Thanks

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1 bekko, 1 sanke, 1 showa, 1 yamabuki ogon, 2 platinum ogons, 1 asagi, 1 orenji/yamabuki ogon, 1 buttefly kohaku, 2 kujaku, 2 shubunkins, 3 comets, 1 sarassa comet, 3 feeder fish, 2 kivers, 1 catfish.

(This post was edited by koineedtoknower on Jan 19, 2006, 4:08 AM)

drcheang
Koi Lover

Jan 19, 2006, 10:07 AM

Post #42 of 55 (4610 views)
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Re: [koineedtoknower] Will my TT design work [In reply to]	Can't Post

Dear John,
You are wellcome. I think ur idea is alright. BTW the spray bar is 5 minutes job. Few 1" pipe with L connector and end cap and a Drill n u r done. Make sure do not cement the end cap so that u can wash the spray bar. Make it tight fit with plumbing seal.
Cheang

edcheong
Koi Lover

Mar 17, 2006, 3:29 PM

Post #43 of 55 (4423 views)
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Re: [drcheang] Will my TT design work [In reply to]	Can't Post

Drcheang,
I hv installed a TT using a PVC tube 54 " x dia.10" 2 months already. How to find out if it is working or not W/O using test kit. Recently a lot of bubbles/foam appeared on the pond.

Rgds
Ed

drcheang
Koi Lover

Mar 17, 2006, 9:46 PM

Post #44 of 55 (4406 views)
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Re: [edcheong] Will my TT design work [In reply to]	Can't Post

Dear Ed,
Seriously I don't know. Usually it takes a few months for it to work. It depends what media u uesd. If u use BH it is faster, bioballs are the slowest.
BTW I m now in Australia for 1 year. So I won't be in this forum as frequent as b4.
Cheang

Koi38
Senior Member

Mar 18, 2006, 7:10 AM

Post #45 of 55 (4401 views)
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Re: [drcheang] Will my TT design work [In reply to]	Can't Post

Hi Cheang,

Off topic mate. Where in Australia are you staying??? I live in Sydney southwest Wink

rgds,
Jon

"DuKu Friendly"
_____________________________________
"No one is ever too old to know better"

http://s3.photobucket.com/albums/y63/Koi38/

drcheang
Koi Lover

Mar 18, 2006, 9:25 AM

Post #46 of 55 (4392 views)
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Re: [Koi38] Will my TT design work [In reply to]	Can't Post

Hi Jon,
I m in Melbourne. Just started work here. Will b here till Jan 2007.
Cheers mate.
Cheang

Gel
Koi Lover

Jan 20, 2007, 12:34 AM

Post #47 of 55 (3753 views)
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Re: [Koi38] Will my TT design work [In reply to]	Can't Post

Where do you get those stackable crates for $2?!
I can use those to organize my closet!

I want to build a TT on a smaller scale for my 72 & 129 gal tanks also.

In Reply To

Hi John,

These what I'm going to use on my TT. Got it yesterday for $2 each, stackable too Wink

. Too good to missed Cool

These will hold 400kg of Lava rocks or bioballs even 200kg of BH will fit Cool

rgds,
Jon

ayranjim
Koi Lover

Jan 20, 2007, 3:08 AM

Post #48 of 55 (3752 views)
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Re: [Koi38] Will my TT design work [In reply to]	Can't Post

Hello, John as every pond is a little different, there is no ONE WAY to do things! What I have done is gone out and buy all kinds of PVC fittings and pipe ect! That way you have a little work shop to play with! Then just practice! The spray bar can be very easy , and yes, you will want to know is there enough holes or not? Well, startwith drilling small holes, then conect things and see! Then try a few more small holes! In worst case senario, you end up using the PVC, but your learning!!!The only way to learn is by our mistakes! But as MURPHYS LAW governs ALL FILTER MAKING, buy alot of PVC elbows ect, because you will find that just when you think you finaly have it, you will notice that your missing ( 1) PVC elbow!! to finish!! so then you have to drive for an hour , then wait in a line ect!! You end up losing a couple of hours of time for a simple piece of plastic. ONE IMPORTANT THING , all the piping and fittings that LEAVE the pump do not have to have PVC cement! This is for testing!!!! DRIPS can be solved, but at least your not wasting so much PVC cementing!!

Abangk
Koi Lover

May 4, 2007, 2:33 PM

Post #49 of 55 (3412 views)
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Re: [koi@kit] Will my TT design work [In reply to]	Can't Post

Hi,

Im new here Cool

.. may I ask if let say we have a waterfall corner and place a bucket of Bio-ring (design it as a waterfall steps) in the middle of this waterfall to pass thru the bio media, will it similar to the idea of putting a spray on the top of the bucket, can it works?..

Best regards
Abangk

(This post was edited by Abangk on May 4, 2007, 5:26 PM)

ricky19
New User

Dec 12, 2007, 6:50 PM

Post #50 of 55 (2434 views)
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Re: [Koi38] Will my TT design work [In reply to]	Can't Post

Hi, am quite new to what has been discussed here. What's the different between TT & BS?

thanks

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