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Home: KOI Talk: DIY Corner:
diy bottom drain

 






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vv
Koi Lover


Oct 10, 2005, 10:48 PM

Post #1 of 30 (3045 views)
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diy bottom drain Can't Post

can somebody teach me how to diy a very efficient bottom drain? thanks


Koi38
Senior Member


Oct 11, 2005, 8:07 AM

Post #2 of 30 (3014 views)
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Re: [vv] diy bottom drain [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi vv,

I'm not trying to discourage you but you'd be better off buying a BD. I'm a pretty good DIY personTongue but I didn't bother thinking of making a BD coz by the time you've done it you'll probably saving few dollars, IMHOSmile A standard BD will cost around $50US or 25pounds or $80AUSD. But hey, if you can make one and post it in this forum I'm sure a lot of members will be knocking on your doorWink

rgds,
Jon

"DuKu Friendly"
_____________________________________
"No one is ever too old to know better"

http://s3.photobucket.com/albums/y63/Koi38/


vv
Koi Lover


Oct 11, 2005, 9:46 AM

Post #3 of 30 (3002 views)
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Re: [Koi38] diy bottom drain [In reply to] Can't Post

i guess i really have to diy the cover because the drains are already beneath the concrete. i should have bought one before. i thought before, that the drain cover can be very simple like placing a screen on top. i'll just try to diy and let you know if it works. by the way, do you think providing an air diffuser on the cover is really worth doing? thanks.


Koi38
Senior Member


Oct 11, 2005, 12:20 PM

Post #4 of 30 (2987 views)
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Re: [vv] diy bottom drain [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi vv,

If you can get your hands on a piece of plastic(UV resist and fodd grade) cut it a foot in diameter. Place four legs just about an in inside the perimeter. What kind of drain you have in the pond??? You have to figure out how to secure the coverSmile

This the first time I'm using an air diffuser on top of my BD and may I say it worth every centsWink It gives you the mushroom effect and draw the waste to the middle where your BD isSmile

rgds,
Jon

"DuKu Friendly"
_____________________________________
"No one is ever too old to know better"

http://s3.photobucket.com/albums/y63/Koi38/


vv
Koi Lover


Oct 11, 2005, 10:45 PM

Post #5 of 30 (2963 views)
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Re: [Koi38] diy bottom drain [In reply to] Can't Post

i have 3 4" drains. i just dont know how to cover them. i'm currently looking for a dome type of bowl, plastic, aluminum and stainless. i think ill go with your suggestion of 12" diameter. i just cant see the perfect arc. how high would you recommend the arc should be?

about the four feet(posts) that you recommend, i think that's a great idea but how do i keep it to floor? and will i be able to pull it up just in case the BD needs servicing?

about the diffuser, i have these cylindrical airstones around 1.5 inch diameter and 2 inches high, im planning to use them as diffuser. what do you say? do i punch a hole in the cover? how deep shall i place it inside the hole of the cover?

thanks again, youre really helping me and giving me confidence in what im doing.


Koi38
Senior Member


Oct 12, 2005, 9:01 AM

Post #6 of 30 (2948 views)
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Re: [vv] diy bottom drain [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi vv,

This is how I'll do it if your drains have egg grate on them. Get rid of some until all you have left is a cross(+) and a small square in the middle like the pic below. You can know use stailess steel nuts, washer and bolts on to hold your cover down. I would try to get a bolt that will fit fairly tight inside the grate(red dots) and secure it with marine glue. I will then attach the nut with washer on you cover. Hand tight will do coz the pressure of the water will also hold the cover down. The cover doesn't have to be a dome shape, a flat shape will do the same job, I've seen one before and it worksSmile The 4 legs can be attached to the cover.

You can get some flat 9" dia diffuser and sit on your cover or you can search Tao Bkk post regarding his DIY ring. I made one before but my dog ate itMad so I just bought oneSmile

rgds,
Jon

PS: The reason why I told you to get rid of some grate is this will prevent it from blocking and will give you better flowWink



"DuKu Friendly"
_____________________________________
"No one is ever too old to know better"

http://s3.photobucket.com/albums/y63/Koi38/


mike c
Koi Kichi


Oct 14, 2005, 10:29 PM

Post #7 of 30 (2851 views)
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Re: [vv] diy bottom drain [In reply to] Can't Post

i think the purpose of the arc is only to keep sediment from collecting on top of the cover.

besides, if you put an air stone or some sort of air diffuser, i doubt there will be collection of poop on top



____________________________________

If you know how it works, you'll know how to fix it


vv
Koi Lover


Oct 15, 2005, 12:03 AM

Post #8 of 30 (2842 views)
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Re: [mike c] diy bottom drain [In reply to] Can't Post

thanks mike and jon,

my problem now is i cant find the flat air diffuser here. can you explain how the air diffuser draws dirt to the drain?

is the diffuser as simple as placing anything that blows air on top of the cover? or there must be direct connection between the bottom drain and air diffuser media (i.e. the cover must not block the diffuser and bottom drain)

also what materials can i use for the air diffuser? currently, i only have air stones and our dealers dont sell the flat air diffusers anymore.

thanks


Koi38
Senior Member


Oct 15, 2005, 12:35 AM

Post #9 of 30 (2839 views)
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Re: [vv] diy bottom drain [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi vv,

can you explain how the air diffuser draws dirt to the drain
Using a fairly large(9") diffuser will create a mushroom effect. This works well if you have dead corners in your pond. The bubbles will push the water up and will spread all over the surface will hit the pond wall and goes back down again towards the center or where the air is coming fromSmile some ppl uses soaker hose as air diffuser or you can use perforated hose as well.

is the diffuser as simple as placing anything that blows air on top of the cover? or there must be direct connection between the bottom drain and air diffuser media (i.e. the cover must not block the diffuser and bottom drain)
You have to secure the diffuser on the cover somehow.

You have to show us some pix so we know what we are looking atSmile

Pic below shows the bubbles raising/pushing the water up


This one shows the bubbles hits the surface


"DuKu Friendly"
_____________________________________
"No one is ever too old to know better"

http://s3.photobucket.com/albums/y63/Koi38/


vv
Koi Lover


Oct 16, 2005, 11:30 AM

Post #10 of 30 (2802 views)
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Re: [Koi38] diy bottom drain [In reply to] Can't Post

ill try to post pics sometime. ill borrow (or steal) my friends digicamCool.
currently, the pond is still under construction. just imagine a hole (4" PVC) on the lowest level of the concrete, waiting to be covered. right now, what i only have is a thick black ceramic plate 11.5" dia. i'm still figuring out how to diy the diffuser just like yours. i also want to get that much bubbles. Yours look so neat and your water is so clear. Hope i can imitate yours.


Koi38
Senior Member


Oct 16, 2005, 3:07 PM

Post #11 of 30 (2791 views)
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Re: [vv] diy bottom drain [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi vv,

My diffuser is not a DIY type, I just DIY it (attached) to my standard BD cover. I bought the 9" diffuser and the middle bit(stand). Drilled a hole thru the cover and put them together.

This is my BD cover with diffuser onSmile

rgds,
Jon





"DuKu Friendly"
_____________________________________
"No one is ever too old to know better"

http://s3.photobucket.com/albums/y63/Koi38/


vv
Koi Lover


Oct 16, 2005, 3:27 PM

Post #12 of 30 (2791 views)
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Re: [Koi38] diy bottom drain [In reply to] Can't Post

Here's the pond with two BDs

the black ceramic plate 11.5"

and the air stone i have


(This post was edited by vv on Oct 16, 2005, 3:28 PM)
Attachments: canon 002a.JPG (63.4 KB)
  canon 003a.JPG (57.2 KB)


vv
Koi Lover


Oct 16, 2005, 3:36 PM

Post #13 of 30 (2783 views)
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Re: [Koi38] diy bottom drain [In reply to] Can't Post

 thanks for being so nice in helping me with my new hobby. the pics really help. i hope i can make mine the same as yours. i really have to look for the diffuser otherwise i have to settle with placing my airstone on top of the cover. by the way, how do you post pics the way you do?


(This post was edited by vv on Oct 16, 2005, 3:41 PM)
Attachments: canon 004a.JPG (23.1 KB)


Koi38
Senior Member


Oct 16, 2005, 3:53 PM

Post #14 of 30 (2774 views)
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Re: [vv] diy bottom drain [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi vv,

You can use the ceramic or perspex as coverSmile we just have to figure out how to attach the cover to your BDCrazy

How big is that air stone and how will you connect the air line to it??? My air line is inside my 4" drain pipe.

rgds,
Jon

"DuKu Friendly"
_____________________________________
"No one is ever too old to know better"

http://s3.photobucket.com/albums/y63/Koi38/


vv
Koi Lover


Oct 16, 2005, 10:40 PM

Post #15 of 30 (2758 views)
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Re: [Koi38] diy bottom drain [In reply to] Can't Post

i'm planning to do it like this, but im gonna use the ceramic plate because it is a lot heavier plus im gonna use cement for the feet. and simply place it on top of the BD with some sort of housing so it won't move. what do you think?
the air stone is 2" in height and also 2" in diameter.
Attachments: BD Cover Bottom-a.JPG (47.1 KB)
  BD Cover Top-a.JPG (42.8 KB)


vv
Koi Lover


Oct 16, 2005, 10:50 PM

Post #16 of 30 (2756 views)
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Re: [Koi38] diy bottom drain [In reply to] Can't Post

the BD will be something like this. Pls bear with my drawingSmile
Attachments: BD plan.JPG (23.8 KB)


Koi38
Senior Member


Oct 17, 2005, 8:32 AM

Post #17 of 30 (2736 views)
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Re: [vv] diy bottom drain [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi vv,

Your plan could work. May I suggest these.......... even though you are using ceramic as cover don't forget that once you place that in the water it will weight less that out of water, so you may want to place 3 legs instead of 2 and make your housing tight fit to prevent it from lifting upSmile I would use 3 airstones and must be ceramics only. See the pic below, this is how I'll do it if I were youWink Pls do not hesitate to ask moreSmile

rgds,
Jon



"DuKu Friendly"
_____________________________________
"No one is ever too old to know better"

http://s3.photobucket.com/albums/y63/Koi38/


vv
Koi Lover


Oct 17, 2005, 11:18 PM

Post #18 of 30 (2717 views)
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Re: [Koi38] diy bottom drain [In reply to] Can't Post

thanks jon. why do you specifically suggest ceramic air stones? also whats with the food grade air tube? by the way i made 4 postsSmile just making sure.


Koi38
Senior Member


Oct 18, 2005, 11:59 AM

Post #19 of 30 (2692 views)
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Re: [vv] diy bottom drain [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi vv,

Ceramic air stones don't fall apart like others, IMHOSmile A food grade tube(or airline) are non toxic. Some hoses are toxic once you place them under water permanently. You can use the one you showed in the pix but I'm not sure how long will they last as I'm only using those type in my biofilter. Maybe someone in the forum that uses those type can share they experienceWink

rgds,
Jon

"DuKu Friendly"
_____________________________________
"No one is ever too old to know better"

http://s3.photobucket.com/albums/y63/Koi38/


vv
Koi Lover


Oct 21, 2005, 9:25 AM

Post #20 of 30 (2651 views)
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Re: [Koi38] diy bottom drain [In reply to] Can't Post

oh i see. thanks. here is the pic of the posts. once, the cover is almost immovable when placed. i can't get a good take becoz i just finished fiberglassing. hate it, it rained while fiberglassing it. you have idea about fiberglassing? you think its ofk if it got wet even if its not yet dry? also don't knw how to rid of the protruding fibers (pic).
Attachments: BD Post.JPG (52.3 KB)
  Fibers.JPG (43.1 KB)


Koi38
Senior Member


Oct 22, 2005, 7:17 PM

Post #21 of 30 (2612 views)
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Re: [vv] diy bottom drain [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi vv,

Looks good so farSmile and you are inluck coz I've done FG before. I hope you gave it some good rubbed down to get rid of the bubbles on the fiberglass sheets. Anyway you can use sand paper to get rid of the fiber thats sticks out but BE VERY CAREFUL coz those dry fibre are like needlesShocked so wear some protections like gloves and mask. What color top coat are you planning to use??? Mine is blackCool

rgds,
Jon

"DuKu Friendly"
_____________________________________
"No one is ever too old to know better"

http://s3.photobucket.com/albums/y63/Koi38/


vv
Koi Lover


Oct 22, 2005, 11:47 PM

Post #22 of 30 (2601 views)
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Re: [Koi38] diy bottom drain [In reply to] Can't Post

it seems like you used bricks for your flooring. i'm planning to use black also. i'm afraid the water might look dirty (not as clear) if i use different color. do you have any idea or experience how will other colors look when the kois start producing dirt? also, what kind of paint did you use? Currently, i tried to test epoxy paint and automotive acrylic. It seems that the acrylic sticks better than the epoxy. and it doesnt need any primer, but i dont have any idea how will it turn out later on when filled with water. the paint in my old pond keeps on chipping off. the contractor said they used aquatic paint but i kept on seeing the topcoat pulling off showing the white primer. i also often hear the marine paint. Do you have any idea about paints for fiberglass?

since you have experience with fiberglass, is it fine if i dont put fibermat on all the walls of the pond? will it affect the fiberglass as a whole? i didnt place fibermat on one side which is the partition of the filter and the pond. will that be fine? because im nt afraid if the water leaks to the filter area. the fiter area is fully fiberglassed though.

i found this diffuser. im planning to stick it on top of the BD cover. what do you think? around 2 or 3? or the other one is better? the diffuser itself is also ceramic but the casing is made of plastic.

also, your pond looks so clear. how do you take care of the algae? i usually see algae forming in glass windows usually, but yours seem so clear.


Koi38
Senior Member


Oct 23, 2005, 12:23 AM

Post #23 of 30 (2597 views)
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Re: [vv] diy bottom drain [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi vv,

it seems like you used bricks for your flooring. My flooring is concrete not bricksTonguei'm planning to use black also. i'm afraid the water might look dirty (not as clear) if i use different color. do you have any idea or experience how will other colors look when the kois start producing dirt? It doesn't realy matter what color you use, once the algea(carpet type) growing on walls and floor everything will be green, IMHO. I just used black so I can see their color much betterSmile also, what kind of paint did you use? I used FG paint. This paint is design to stick to FG and comes in diff colors.Currently, i tried to test epoxy paint and automotive acrylic. It seems that the acrylic sticks better than the epoxy. and it doesnt need any primer, but i dont have any idea how will it turn out later on when filled with water. the paint in my old pond keeps on chipping off. the contractor said they used aquatic paint but i kept on seeing the topcoat pulling off showing the white primer. i also often hear the marine paint. Do you have any idea about paints for fiberglass? as far as I know the FG paint are called resin then you mix it catalyst(hardener) The more catalyst you add on resin the quicker it dries. But be careful it means you have to paint it really quick tooShockedTongue

since you have experience with fiberglass, is it fine if i dont put fibermat on all the walls of the pond? will it affect the fiberglass as a whole? i didnt place fibermat on one side which is the partition of the filter and the pond. will that be fine because im nt afraid if the water leaks to the filter area. the fiter area is fully fiberglassed though. If I were you I will apply FG matt on walls too. . When the walls crack(hairline crack) you will have water quality probs once the lime or calsium started leaking to your pond.
i found this diffuser. im planning to stick it on top of the BD cover. what do you think? around 2 or 3? or the other one is better? the diffuser itself is also ceramic but the casing is made of plastic. If the diffuser will produce more tiny bubbles than original plan I'll use it, don't worry about the plasticWink Any pic of this diffuser???

also, your pond looks so clear. how do you take care of the algae? i usually see algae forming in glass windows usually, but yours seem so clear. I use something like the one you use to clean your car window. I clean it once a month if my koi are too lazy to clean the windowsTongueLaugh

rgds,
Jon

"DuKu Friendly"
_____________________________________
"No one is ever too old to know better"

http://s3.photobucket.com/albums/y63/Koi38/


vv
Koi Lover


Oct 23, 2005, 1:48 PM

Post #24 of 30 (2586 views)
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Re: [Koi38] diy bottom drain [In reply to] Can't Post

thanks jon, here's the diffuser.



Koi38
Senior Member


Oct 24, 2005, 10:31 AM

Post #25 of 30 (2562 views)
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Re: [vv] diy bottom drain [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi vv,

If you can a smaller version of this air stones you can connect them forming a circle and place them on top of your cover. You will get same effect as my diffuserWink

rgds,
Jon

"DuKu Friendly"
_____________________________________
"No one is ever too old to know better"

http://s3.photobucket.com/albums/y63/Koi38/

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