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Home: KOI Talk: Koi Breeding:
Females First Spawn

 





 


ringer301
Koi Lover


Jul 1, 2003, 11:43 AM

Post #1 of 8 (1415 views)
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Females First Spawn Can't Post
Its been a long couple days.. with a few surprises.. got up on Friday morning and one of my females ripped apart all the nice surface plants in the pond. I noticed she was layin over and brushing them... not having males any here at the house, I ran down to a friends place and grabbed 2 of his males... took them about an hour to get used to the new surroundings... and then... it started... not the most romantic thing I've ever seen... more I would say on the violent side... there were times when the males rammed so hard that she would come clean outta the water.. In about 8 hours it was over... and all was calm.. the males went back home... and tanker (24" shiro utsuri, female, she's my baby) went into another tank for a rest and a diet of brine shirmp and krill, and few other treats... I got some good video shots of it... I know I have planned to breed koi for serveral years.. and this is just the start... I have only kept about 5000 eggs.. I took some of the plants plastic containers that held them that had the most eggs them.. and put them into an airated tank with the pond water.. I figure I'll let the other koi eat whats letf in the pond... its monday now.. and I hope to see some of the eggs start to form in a few days.. it'll be interesting to see how many will come out of it.. I fingure if I end up with another 30-50 fish.. then thats good... it'll add to the 200 I have now...
But what a fasinating thing to watch... I have 10 more females that I want to breed.. but have built breed tanks for them.. and those will be planned..this just happened outta the blue...

just a story from the last couple days... just thought I would share it with you...


BranMuffin
Koi Kichi


Jul 1, 2003, 11:57 AM

Post #2 of 8 (1410 views)
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Re: [ringer301] Females First Spawn [In reply to] Can't Post
Scary to watch isn't it? Especially the first time. You think OMG they're gonna kill her! Most Violent!

So when you show your video, you'd better tell the people that it contains extreme violence!

Best Regards
Bran

A Koi Pond is never FINISHED, it's always subject to improvement.
Drives the Spouse Crazy!


khaku 4
Koi Lover

Jul 4, 2003, 9:43 AM

Post #3 of 8 (1370 views)
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Re: [BranMuffin] Females First Spawn [In reply to] Can't Post
wow thats a great true story to tell

my koi havent bred yet because they're only 6-7 inches and besides i cant tell female from male Unsure.

is petsmart a good place to buy them i want to try that some time. i always get my koi at the local provider,but they're freaking exspensive, i heard you could get a 4-5 incher for like 14.99 at petsmart, i want to try it sometime it probably would be worth it but they mibht be sort'a mid quality oh well. if your gonna have a koi doesnt mean they have to be high quality or a unique type(every koi is unique in they're iwn way.

if you can gimme feed back that would be great i need help with this stuff(my pond is fairly green,is that a bad thing Unimpressed)

heres my email (if your gonna reply email me please because i barely go on this website) here it is- Smile thekoiboy@earthlink.netTongue

thanks for reading my post

-eric(khaku 4)


ringer301
Koi Lover


Jul 6, 2003, 2:06 AM

Post #4 of 8 (1339 views)
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Re: [khaku 4] Females First Spawn [In reply to] Can't Post
Just an update... I was very disappointed in the fact that over the next couple days, all the eggs when cloudy and fuzzy... the first night our temp dropped here to about -2.. and the tank that I had put the eggs into had ice on it... all the eggs lost from what I could see... I put a small heater in the water and watched for a couple days.. all eggs fuzzy... In a state of dispare... I never went back into the shed until this morning, for the gruling job of cleaning the tank out... and dammed it theres not about 500 (best guess) little kio swimming around.. if sperm had eyes.. this is what they'd look like.. hahaha so. Im back today to read on what to do now.. wif look'd in the tank yesterday and didnt see anything.. so they must have all hatched last night.... the adventure begins..


BranMuffin
Koi Kichi


Jul 6, 2003, 2:46 AM

Post #5 of 8 (1336 views)
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Re: [ringer301] Females First Spawn [In reply to] Can't Post
Congratulations Poppa!

Koi eggs do not all hatch. If they did, you would be overwhelmed by the sheer numbers of them. A decent size koi can hatch over 250,000 eggs! Yes, you read that right.

But about 1/2 of them will die right away due to being unfertilized, attacked by bacteria ..etc. The other half will further be reduced by the other fish eating on them, getting sucked in by the pump ..etc.

Once they hatch, they're very weak and anything will kill them. They are very vulnerable to water parameter changes and even the slightest sudden change can kill them... Especially Temperature and PH.

Now that you have fry's, you need to keep the water in prestine condition. Siphone out the bottom of the tank often. Change 10% of the water every couple of days (be sure to dichlorinate the water), and if you can aerate (gentle aeration only), it would benefit them a lot. Get a small aerator and air stone that puts out tiny bubbles and put it in a corner of the tank. You want air in the tank but not directly on the little guys, so a corner area will do.

Some ppl worry about diseases attacking them, so a little Methelyne Blue will do. Use about 1/2 the recommended dosage just to keep the bacteria in check.

Feeding: You really don't have to worry about feeding them for a couple of weeks because they will feed on some of the proteins left in the egg sack and other floating materials. If you do want to feed them, the yolk of a boiled egg will do, but use VERY LITTLE of it at a time .. less than a pinch. That's because it fouls easily and will make them sick if left in the tank. One of the tricks that I use is to take about 1/4 of the yolk, put it in a deep dish (soup bowl) and very slowly lower it into the bottom of the tank (because it tends to crumble). The fry's will find it and start munching on the outsides. I have often thought of putting a yolk in some kind of a very fine netting tied to a string, and lowering it just enough for them to locate and feed on, but never got around to it.

Leave it there for a couple of hours then remove and discard it. That's all they need for the day and do it again every day for a couple of weeks. By that time, they should be big enough to eat baby flaked foods that you can buy at an aquarium store. Or you can finely crumble up some cheerios ... just a few... and I mean a few .. because it can also foul up the water.

Good Luck!

Best Regards
Bran

A Koi Pond is never FINISHED, it's always subject to improvement.
Drives the Spouse Crazy!

(This post was edited by BranMuffin on Jul 6, 2003, 2:55 AM)


ringer301
Koi Lover


Jul 8, 2003, 4:30 AM

Post #6 of 8 (1310 views)
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Re: [BranMuffin] Females First Spawn [In reply to] Can't Post
day 3 and all is fine so far... I have them in a 100 gallon aquarium, about 1/3 full of water.. each day I put about 4 gallons of the pond water in to keep it fresh, I think once its full then I will start on water changes, I have only found 1 or 2 dead ones floating around. so this leads me to believe that all is going well so far... indredably enough you can start to see color already in some.. mind you its only solid black or white. I cleaned out the tank today of the plants that held the eggs, some where starting to rot so I figured to keep the water at its best quality it would be best to take some out... I added some of the "blue" today, just in case. I've scoped the water and didnt see any strange bacteria roaming.. I still cant get a count on how many I got.. I know theres lots.. but once I took the plants out, alot more could be seen.. I'd venture a guess in the range of... well.. 150 to 500 .. lol its hard to tell.. Im glad now that I only put in about 5 egg laiden plants.. because the amount of eggs just on those plants.. is probly more fish then I can handle.. If all goes well.. I think I'll build another few holding tanks to handled the new ones once they get bigger..


johan1011
Koi Lover

Oct 12, 2003, 10:09 PM

Post #7 of 8 (1143 views)
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Re: [BranMuffin] Females First Spawn [In reply to] Can't Post
Dear Bran

As my first eggs is out ,and everything whent well until the fry starts swimming around most of them suddenly start to die i really dont know what it could be,as my pool is my new koi pond Sly 17x6x1.5m i also spawned my koi in there ,the water is a litlle green now my second parcel of eggs game out this morning and i really dont want them to die toFrownwhat can it be and what can i do to keep them alive ?

Please help

Thanks

jmCrazy


BranMuffin
Koi Kichi


Oct 13, 2003, 6:18 AM

Post #8 of 8 (1136 views)
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Re: [johan1011] Females First Spawn [In reply to] Can't Post
The best chance for a newly hatched fry to survive is to move it into a separate raising tank. Actually, it should have been moved there when it was still an egg.

There's just too many things that can go wrong inside a fish pond, from water parameter fluctuation, to bacterial infection, to natural and unatural predators. i.e. Larger fish will eat eggs and newly hatched fry's .. they also get sucked into the pumps inlet pipes.

Newly hatched fry's are very sensitive to water changes, ammonia, ph, nitrite and temperature. You can be sure that you ph will fluctuate between day, night and early morning hours. Also, if your other fish are still breeding, then you have additional ammonia to contend with as well as reduction in oxygen. Additionally there's always some form of bacteria in your pond. Whether it's on the other fish or within the water itself, they will attack the small fry's.

It may be too late to move the hatched fry's into a separate tank, but should you chose to do so, follow the some of the proceedures as posted above. Otherwise, you can just let nature take it's course. ...and as long as you have some hiding places within the pond, some of your little ones should survive, probably more than you'd want to keep.

You can add a little Non-Iodized salt in the pond .1-.3% just to keep the bacteria in check or you can get some anti-fungal/anti-bacterial medication and put it in the pond. They have these medications specially for eggs and fry's although I don't remember their names. You can also try some Methelyne Blue (maybe 1/2 the suggested concentration). Some people will do the Malachite Green solution, but it's easy to OD with Malachite Green as well as it competes with the oxygen content in the water. I don't think that I would use it. It will also (depending on the % of the solution) kill your Aerobic bacteria in the filtration system. ...and it should not be used in addition to salt.

If you decide to keep the fry's in the pond, here are my suggestions:

1) Monitor your water parameters daily for Ammonia, and PH.

2) Add some anti-fungal/anti-Bacterial medication ...salt or Methelyne Blue.

3) Put some additional aeration in the pond. An inexpensive air pump with an airstone that puts out very fine bubbles.

4) Do a 10% water change daily, taking the water from the bottom of the pond.

5) You don't need to worry about feeding them for at least a month because there's lots of micro organisms and floating food including algae that they can eat. After that then they will feed on the leftover food that the other fish leaves ...or.. you can feed them some crushed cheerios. By this time, they should be around 1" -2" in size.

Hope this helps.

Best Regards
Bran

A Koi Pond is never FINISHED, it's always subject to improvement.
Drives the Spouse Crazy!

(This post was edited by BranMuffin on Oct 13, 2003, 6:21 AM)

 
 
 



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