Koi Forum (Nishikigoi - Japanese Koi Fish): KOI Talk: Koi Breeding: How big do Koi get?

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How big do Koi get?

kitsen
Koi Lover

Jun 1, 2003, 1:35 PM

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How big do Koi get?	Can't Post

What's the largest koi ever recorded? What kind of Koi was/is it? Do koi stop growing after a certain size, or do they keep growing for as long as they live? And will they keep breeding... or do they stop after a certain age or size?

kitsen
Koi Lover

Jun 6, 2003, 11:28 PM

Post #2 of 15 (2238 views)
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Re: [kitsen] How big do Koi get? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Nobody knows?

Well anyway, a book I read says that under ideal conditions in Japan, Koi have been recorded at more than 37.5in.

It is quite possible for most koi to reach at least 27.5in in favorable conditions.

On another note it says that the oldest Koi recorded was in Japan, named, 'Hanako.' It was just over 200 years old.

In good conditions, koi ahould normally live around 60 years.

BranMuffin
Koi Kichi

Jun 6, 2003, 11:46 PM

Post #3 of 15 (2236 views)
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Re: [kitsen] How big do Koi get? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Hanako lived to be over 226 years old. She was born 5 years before the Declaration of Independence, 77 centimeters long and weight at 9 kilograms. Owned by a Mr. Komeri Koshibara in the Gifu prefecture in Japan.

At that time they thought that the age of a Koi could be determined by the number of rings on the scale (as examined under a microscope) just as you would determine a trees age by it's rings. However there's a controversy over this and some experst say that determining a koi's age by it's rings isn't an accurate measure. So who really knows?

Never-the-less, that's still a very long time under the right conditions and raised in the field ponds. But in a home made pond such as concrete and again under the right conditions, they have determined that a koi could live to around 50 years.

I'm almost half way there as I have a couple of Koi that's about 22 years old and still going strong albeit they're loosing their once beautiful markings and coloring.

In fact I should cull some of them out to make room for some new ones. I just can't do it! After all, they've been with me all these years. It would be like putting Grandma away before her time.

So my pond fish doesn't look as good and as elegant as it once did, but I have some very large fish which impresses a lot of people!

Anyway Kitsen, I would say this is a very big koi, wouldn't you say? Either that or the guy is a Midget!

Best Regards
Bran

A Koi Pond is never FINISHED, it's always subject to improvement.
Drives the Spouse Crazy!

(This post was edited by BranMuffin on Jun 6, 2003, 11:58 PM)

kitsen
Koi Lover

Jun 7, 2003, 12:09 AM

Post #4 of 15 (2231 views)
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Re: [BranMuffin] How big do Koi get? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Wait. Is that a pic of one of your carp... or is that Hanako? Tongue

Anyway, great info on Hanako! Where did you get it? I wonder who cared for Hanako after Mr. Komeri. We're talking at least three generations of long lived humans here!

I think they determine age of oceanfish by the otolith, or ear bone. I'm not sure about koi. Probably possible.

toke
Koi Lover

Jun 8, 2003, 4:56 PM

Post #5 of 15 (2219 views)
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Re: [BranMuffin] How big do Koi get? [In reply to]	Can't Post

branmuffin said :

"Hanako lived to be over 226 years old. She was born 5 years before the Declaration of Independence, 77 centimeters long and weight at 9 kilograms. Owned by a Mr. Komeri Koshibara in the Gifu prefecture in Japan."

it should read like this: Hanako lived to be over 226 years old. She was born 5 years before the Declaration of Independence,and 23 years before the great branmuffin was on this earth, 77 centimeters long and weight at 9 kilograms. Owned by a Mr. Komeri Koshibara in the Gifu prefecture in Japan

alright thats the last time i call you old with out saying it Tongue

but i had too ok, ok, but i would like to thank you, branmuffin for all the help you give me and to all the nice people that use this form. some of the stuff you shair with us a read 2 or 3 times over to make sure i did not skip over anything. so a big thanks from me to you

rogermoo
Member

Jun 12, 2003, 10:07 PM

Post #6 of 15 (2169 views)
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Re: [toke] How big do Koi get? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Hi kitsen, BranMuffin & Toke,

Check out this website www.momotaro-koi.org. Their jumbo size koi have grown to more than 80cm in length (if I am not wrong) and have won numerous ZNA championship awards.

You can also visit their farm and view them in their 1500 tons man made pond. Yearly they do auction for their big koi.

Rogermoo7, the local koibond

BranMuffin
Koi Kichi

Jun 12, 2003, 10:37 PM

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Re: [rogermoo] How big do Koi get? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Thanks!

80 cm is about 31 1/2 inches. I have about 4 of them left in my pond. The bar has risen and the challenge now is 91cm! I have a Showa that just hit it!

Best Regards
Bran

A Koi Pond is never FINISHED, it's always subject to improvement.
Drives the Spouse Crazy!

rogermoo
Member

Jun 16, 2003, 1:19 AM

Post #8 of 15 (2137 views)
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Re: [BranMuffin] How big do Koi get? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Hi BranMuffin,

Sorry I got the reading wrong. A kohaku named 'shoei' (?) bred by Okayama Momotaro and owned by Mr, Manzo Kaneko won the 35th Shinkoukai All-Japan Nishikigoi 'Big Champion' title.

Its size is 92cm in length and it is only 5 years old and according to them, this koi will still grow!

Your showa looks beautiful and big indeed, but here is a jumbo kohaku that's huge and he is the one that won the 35th Shinkoukai All-Japan Nishikigoi 'Big Champion' 1st prize! (LOL).

Chow.
Rogermoo7, the local koibond.

douglezzz
Koi Lover

Jun 16, 2003, 7:54 PM

Post #9 of 15 (2123 views)
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Re: [rogermoo] How big do Koi get? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Well....... I raise Great Danes. One of the main problems with them is these yokels trying to raise dogs for extreme color quality and ignoring the correct body confirmation of them. You get inbred, skinny, no head, skittish garbage which dominates the American show ring
The other problem is yoyos trying to breed 40 inch tall 250 pound MONSTER dogs.
I now see that the koi world has the same problems.
Like that goof with the 90 cm orange "champion" you see
on the net.
How big in a year ? How big in 3 ? Cloning ? etc...etc...
SuperGrow food !
Absolute Nonsense !
These fish, like all creatures, have certain genetic traits.
Trying to outdo God with this outlandish chemical /food treatment ( Hello there Doc "PP bomber" Conrad) is like putting a child on growth hormone and steroids to create something un-natural and prone to problems like old Andre the Giant (wrestler, dead).
Well... thats just my 52 cents worth but if you want to see rambling... www.kickshawharlequins.com
I'm building 5 16x16x 5 foot deep tanks and am going to start a koi breeding program this month.
I have some extreme fish to begin with but I plan to go out on a limb and strive for the health and toughness of the real carp while maintaining coloration and body of the show koi. It is going to be quite a project but I managed it with dogs and I'll do my best to do it with koi. Hell it'll only take 20 years or so.....
I hear so many problems with the koi ,as I did with the danes. The koi ( carp) is one of the hardiest fish in the world. It will thrive in absolutely horrible conditions. All other fish die in poor conditions and carp are still hanging in there.
These breeders have gained great color and rapid, overkill, growth but at the same time, took a hardy fish and made it a weakling.
I have a mission now......
I will begin with the shiro utsuri/bekko, since I see life in black and white.

Crazy

(This post was edited by douglezzz on Jun 16, 2003, 8:08 PM)

HWONG
Koi Addict

Jun 16, 2003, 11:53 PM

Post #10 of 15 (2112 views)
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Re: [douglezzz] How big do Koi get? [In reply to]	Can't Post

What a coincidence, I have a 1 yr old male fawn dane. I have his pic posted at Puppy .com.my gallery. I share your opinion that the Dane has been bred into a giant pussy cat. Most Danes in Malaysia has lost the head. I hope mine is ok. I believe the American Dane shud have some German blood infused to bring back its elegant MAcho look.

I believe the koi industry has recognised the problems associated with in-breeding but not many with the exception of a few has braved the unknown to cross breed with wild carp. Its a commercial thing I guess. Why risk the change when its a booming business selling beautiful but weak kois. OR maybe thta's is what they want. The higher the mortality the more you buy. The 3rd issue of koibito magazine has an article about experimental cross breeding to strenghthen the koi but they are not getting very encouraging results.

MAybe you will have better results. Wishing you success. I will visit your Dane site.

toke
Koi Lover

Jun 20, 2003, 11:38 AM

Post #11 of 15 (2074 views)
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Re: [douglezzz] How big do Koi get? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Quote

These fish, like all creatures, have certain genetic traits.
Trying to outdo God with this outlandish chemical /food treatment ( Hello there Doc "PP bomber" Conrad) is like putting a child on growth hormone and steroids to create something un-natural and prone to problems like old Andre the Giant (wrestler, dead).

would you clip your kids ears to make to make them look better? how about we clip kois fins. sorry to be so blunt, i just think that's wrong to clip a dogs ears but that's my 2 cents. if everyone had the same opinion the world would be a boring place Unsure

. but i cant wate to see some of your koi

andyng
Koi Lover

Jun 21, 2003, 10:27 PM

Post #12 of 15 (2059 views)
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Re: [toke] How big do Koi get? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Toke,

I share the same opinion as I have 2 Boxer dog and did not clip their ears as most people does. I always thought it makes them look silly with those pointed eyes just like Dr. Spook in Star Trek.

My other 2 sens (Malaysian currency) worth

Andy Ng.

douglezzz
Koi Lover

Jun 24, 2003, 5:42 AM

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Re: [andyng] How big do Koi get? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Ok OK oK... I give.. LOL.................
Yeah I did some clipping ears to " fit in " in the show ring....
Other than that I breed for health and longevity and dont care about 36 inches 200 lbs at 1 year nor will I attempt to produce a 24 inch Koi in 2 years..
You confused the point of my rant.
One is cosmetic ( which I don't care for ear trimming either) the other is pushing nature by manipulating growth through drugs, food, steroids etc.. BIG DIFFERENCE.

toke
Koi Lover

Jun 25, 2003, 8:30 AM

Post #14 of 15 (2019 views)
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Re: [douglezzz] How big do Koi get? [In reply to]	Can't Post

"You confused the point of my rant.
One is cosmetic ( which I don't care for ear trimming either) the other is pushing nature by manipulating growth through drugs, food, steroids etc.. BIG DIFFERENCE."

Quote

this is true i did get confused Unsure

but isn't growth(size) cosmetic? j/k Smile

(This post was edited by toke on Jun 25, 2003, 8:37 AM)

douglezzz
Koi Lover

Jun 25, 2003, 8:35 PM

Post #15 of 15 (2007 views)
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Re: [toke] How big do Koi get? [In reply to]	Can't Post

In Reply To

Quote

this is true i did get confused Unsure

but isn't growth(size) cosmetic? j/k Smile

Hehehehe... It aint the size that counts...as long as it aint TOO small LOL Tongue

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