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Home: KOI Talk: Pond Construction & Water Filtering System:
New Pond

 






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kelvinbay
Koi Lover

Jun 26, 2008, 4:12 PM

Post #26 of 54 (1987 views)
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Re: [DavidSoon] New Pond [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi David,

really appreciate your patience on explaining and clarifying the various issues, in particularly the myth pertaining water flow and "fish bending".

This thread has gain a lot of attention since your involvement and I am sure a lot of us gained invaluable knowledge through your posts.

My pond is still leaking, approximately 1cm per day. Based on the pond depth of 1.75m, leakage is approximately 0.57% a day. I am thinking of stopping to trace where the leakage is if it stay at this rate. Afterall I am going to change 2-3% of the water daily anyway. Your view on my current predicaments ?

Kelvin


Epal63
Koi Lover

Jun 26, 2008, 4:34 PM

Post #27 of 54 (1981 views)
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Re: [kelvinbay] New Pond [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Kevin,

Could you share with us what have you done so far in attempting to arrest the leakage?


kelvinbay
Koi Lover

Jun 26, 2008, 5:12 PM

Post #28 of 54 (1975 views)
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Re: [koinutx] New Pond [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi,

so you are saying you should not have build the shelter cause it shield the UV light and result in your Yamabuki to have pale yellow ?

Actually, I have this question in mind for quite a while : exactly which component of the sunlight is good for koi, in particularly the metallic koi ? The UV component, Infra-Red component or the visible light ?

I have this idea of installing solar film, the kind we installed on our car windscreen to prevent excessive heat (eg V-Kool), to the shelter to reduce heat penetration but am worried that will deny the fishes the sunray required to keep their shine. Glad you share your experience with your Yamabuki.

Anyone has anything to share pertaining sunlight for koi ?


DavidSoon
Koi Lover


Jun 26, 2008, 5:38 PM

Post #29 of 54 (1970 views)
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Re: [kelvinbay] New Pond [In reply to] Can't Post

   
A STITCH IN TIME SAVES NINE .

Hi Kelvin ,

Water leakage , if not addressed , would leads to bigger headache . Today at 0.57% , next month would be at 5.7% and there after would be 57% ... and next year we might see you keeping crocodile when your pond dried up ...!!!SlySlySly .. Just kidding ... not that serious yet lah !!SlySlySly

Honestly , It's not a problem that you should sit on at the moment . Believe you can see the traces of leakage by now .. This trace/s happened to be the unfilled hole/s in the wall structure that water tunnel it's way out of the pond . Plugging these holes you see will not help , bcos water would still try to find other routes to migrate . You have to plug from where it starts .Here's what you should do together with your contractor .

1 ) Check all the water pipings that's in liason with the pond . Believe your contractors would know the whole pipe layout , even the concealed pipings . If your concealed pipings is punctuated due to other installations in the pond , you have to stop using this "line " and make do with an external lines . ( One good way to check is by diverting the water outlet from the pump straight to the main pond by running a temporary pipe from pump ( last chamber ) to main pond - for testing only ) If you have tried this and water still missing , then it's not water piping problem . This way you can still keep your concealed pipings .. SlySly , but if the water leak stops when you try this , then you are likely to forgo the conceal pipes and run external outlets .PVC pipes hardly crack , but it can be punctuated thru drillings while installing something else , maybe the stands of the shelters or even pins from holders ... etc .. etc .

2 ) If the water leak is still there after the above test , ( means not piping's fault ) , drain out the whole pond to check the water proofings .
I wondered what they use for water proofing in your pond by the way ?? I fibered-glass my pond internal by the way .
A little costly but gauranteed to last a longer time ( Few thousand dollars ) .
If you trust the waterproofing work , it's fine . Now it's time for you to go down to your emptied pond and check-out all the joints ,
piping joints or link , nothing must be left un-waterproofed or sealed . Even the libs of the drainage covers must be properly sealed with
water proofings around it . The inlets from main pond to the filter chambers . These libs have to be done same as well .
All corners and wall joints . This check apply to your filter chambers as well . Check all links and joints . To be doubly sure .
get your water-proofing guy along and double sealed the joints and libs again .

Honestly Kelvin , it should not take more than a week to rectify this problem . Worst scenario , is to fiber-glass the whole pond interior again if it's not the water-piping problem . Constructed ponds above ground level normally have leakage problem that's more visible than those ponds built below ground level . So .. don't despair ...SlySlySly Short term headache ... but long term enjoyment .
By the time you know how to rectify this leakage problem , you would be able to share your experience better ..SlySlySly Never Never treat this water loss as water change !!! Water change and flushing is totally a different thing ..LaughLaugh

If you really really need help to sort out the water-proofing issue or spot the leakage , let me know ... I might send the whole gang of experts down to your place to trouble-shoot this problem .SlySly Not so nice for your contractor though ...

Cheers
David


koinutx
Koi Lover


Jun 27, 2008, 8:45 AM

Post #30 of 54 (1912 views)
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Re: [kelvinbay] New Pond [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Kelvin,

The shelter is good is preventing rain water, and leave to go into the pond. But the solar film is causing the problem of cutting off the UV ray. Hence, maybe not all glass panel should be installed with Solar Film (probably 60-70%?), so that the koi can still enjoy some sun-tan.Tongue

As for the discussion that David mentioned about Long Wave and Short Wave, i do not have sufficient knowledge on it.Blush

If you would like to view my setup, pm me.Tongue

As for your leak.....do you have any featured wall, waterfall...etc? those are the potential area too. Anyway...good luck in your search...Angelic


kelvinbay
Koi Lover

Jun 29, 2008, 10:21 AM

Post #31 of 54 (1853 views)
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Re: [Epal63] New Pond [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi,

The first thing I did was to isolate the main pond from the filtration chambers. That led to the conclusion that the main pond water integrity was ok and it was the filtration chambers who leaked.

Next, I isolated the individual chambers and found out that chamber no.2 was the culprit. Further observations revealed that it was bottom drain pipe between chamber no.2 and the flushing chamber leaked. I therefore need to choke both end of the drain pipe stop the leakage.

With this problem solved, I raised the water level to a level just sufficient to link all the chambers while keeping the main pond isolated from the filtration chambers. After 1-2 days of observation, water level maintained. I then removed the pipes that isolated the main pond and the filtration. After another 1 day of observation, water level maintained.

Finally, I raised the water level to above the water skimmers. To my disappointment, leakage re-surfaced at a rate of approx 1cm per 24hr. I am now concentrating my search effort in the top section of the filtration chambers and had asked my contractors to come back and water proof this section again this coming week. Keeping my fingers crossed that this will work.

Any comments ?


kelvinbay
Koi Lover

Jun 29, 2008, 10:29 AM

Post #32 of 54 (1851 views)
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Re: [DavidSoon] New Pond [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi David,

thanks for your advice. I am now emptying my pond and asked the contractors back to checked and patched all the suspected areas of leakage. The effort will be concentrated on the top areas of the filtrations (see my previous post).

My plan is that if it still leak, I will probably turn to the fibreglass option. I think that's the only sure way of preventing not only the immediate leakage ut also future ones.

Thanks again.


kelvinbay
Koi Lover

Jun 29, 2008, 10:35 AM

Post #33 of 54 (1848 views)
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Re: [koinutx] New Pond [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi,

I would certainly like to view your set up but am channelling all my effort in arresting the leakage in the pond at the moment. No featured walls or water falls in my pond design, the leakage seems to be due poor cement and water proofing job by my contractors.

I will PM you once this big headache is solved.

Thanks.


(This post was edited by kelvinbay on Jun 29, 2008, 10:37 AM)


DavidSoon
Koi Lover


Jun 29, 2008, 2:06 PM

Post #34 of 54 (1832 views)
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Re: [kelvinbay] New Pond [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Kelvin ,

You have to make sure it's not the pipings that caused the leakage first before you decide on the fiber-glass work . If you feel and finalised that it's not the piping problems , then go ahead with fiber glass coating . This is the ultimate coating for pond interior . Honestly , most water-proofing besides fiber-glass work still faces some problem after a couple of years , especially when you install chiller . Expansion and shrinking of the concrete wall can damage the normal epoxy of clay water-proofing . Prevention is better than cure .SlySlySly I went through this fuss a few times already when my normal water-proofing work starts to crack in the chilly water . No prejudice against any work here . Just a casual comment .SlySlySly

Cheers and good luck on your leak hunting !!!

David


koinutx
Koi Lover


Jun 30, 2008, 9:04 AM

Post #35 of 54 (1788 views)
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Re: [kelvinbay] New Pond [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
Hi,

I would certainly like to view your set up but am channelling all my effort in arresting the leakage in the pond at the moment. No featured walls or water falls in my pond design, the leakage seems to be due poor cement and water proofing job by my contractors.

I will PM you once this big headache is solved.

Thanks.



Kelvin,

Do you know what type of Cement or Concrete are used for your pond?
When I was doing my pond, the contractor was telling me that he choose a certain grade of Rock Concrete mixture, which is water proof in nature, compare to another type which is more sand base, and required water proofing work on the finishing surfacec.
He also told me that the pond need to be soak in water for a few days, to allow the concrete to get the water load for compacting the 'air-space' and during that period, leaking may occur. But it should stop after 3-4days.

Not sure whether I had been "bull-shited".....Crazy

For the visit, just pm me...Tongue


Epal63
Koi Lover

Jun 30, 2008, 11:08 AM

Post #36 of 54 (1774 views)
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Re: [kelvinbay] New Pond [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
Hi,

The first thing I did was to isolate the main pond from the filtration chambers. That led to the conclusion that the main pond water integrity was ok and it was the filtration chambers who leaked.

Next, I isolated the individual chambers and found out that chamber no.2 was the culprit. Further observations revealed that it was bottom drain pipe between chamber no.2 and the flushing chamber leaked. I therefore need to choke both end of the drain pipe stop the leakage.

With this problem solved, I raised the water level to a level just sufficient to link all the chambers while keeping the main pond isolated from the filtration chambers. After 1-2 days of observation, water level maintained. I then removed the pipes that isolated the main pond and the filtration. After another 1 day of observation, water level maintained.

Finally, I raised the water level to above the water skimmers. To my disappointment, leakage re-surfaced at a rate of approx 1cm per 24hr. I am now concentrating my search effort in the top section of the filtration chambers and had asked my contractors to come back and water proof this section again this coming week. Keeping my fingers crossed that this will work.

Any comments ?


Hi Kevin,

It is best if you could narrow down the possible location(s) where the possible leakage is/are/

Just would like to understand the situation better.
(1) You mentioned you have isolated your main pond from your filter chambers. Can I please confirm that you maintained the water level (max) in your main pond all this while and there is no leakage?
(2) When you fill-up the filter-chambers during your tests, did the water level drop to always to a certain level? ie. if you fill-up the water chamber again, it will drop to that level and maintain at that level even after a few days?


koinutx
Koi Lover


Aug 2, 2008, 5:46 PM

Post #37 of 54 (1491 views)
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Re: [Epal63] New Pond [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Kelvin,

How's your pond?
Time for putting in the fishes?Smile


kelvinbay
Koi Lover

Aug 4, 2008, 10:51 AM

Post #38 of 54 (1439 views)
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Re: [koinutx] New Pond [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Koinutx,

you must have some form of sixth sense !

I have ironed out all the outstanding issues and is currently making final preparations for the first batches of fishes to be introduced on 08-08-08 8pm !

I would like to take this opportunity to thank yourself, David, Acurrent01, Koi@kit, Epal63, Ouch and others who has offered so much advices without which I would have taken even more time to solve the problems.

Thanks guys !


Kelvin


koi@kit
Senior Member


Aug 4, 2008, 11:19 AM

Post #39 of 54 (1435 views)
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Re: [kelvinbay] New Pond [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Kevin..

i will b in singapore on the 8th, too bad 8pm i m oredi at airport... may b can arrange with jacky to pay u a visit heheLaughSly...

enjoy and share pictures....

rgds
kit


kelvinbay
Koi Lover

Aug 4, 2008, 12:11 PM

Post #40 of 54 (1434 views)
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Re: [koi@kit] New Pond [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi, you are most welcome !

What time is your flight ? If possible, you can come around between 530pm-7pm, have a drink and some food. I can also asked a few more kakis to come around and we can have a short Happy Hour !

Anyone else out there wanna join us ? Invitations open, PM me please.


Kelvin


koi@kit
Senior Member


Aug 4, 2008, 2:15 PM

Post #41 of 54 (1418 views)
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Re: [kelvinbay] New Pond [In reply to] Can't Post

hi Kevin..

thanks for the invitation but i have to check in by 7pm, my flight 9pm.. dont think have enough time to visit u.. will b in singapore again sometime in september.. will arrange visit to ur new pond...Wink

rgds
kit


kelvinbay
Koi Lover

Aug 4, 2008, 3:31 PM

Post #42 of 54 (1411 views)
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Re: [koi@kit] New Pond [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Koi@kit,

sure. Do let me know when you are visiting Singapore again. Cheers !


Kelvin


DavidSoon
Koi Lover


Aug 4, 2008, 7:48 PM

Post #43 of 54 (1390 views)
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Re: [kelvinbay] New Pond [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Kelvin ,

Happy to know all well ends well ..SlySlySly

08 - 08 - 08 , 8 pm 8 minutes and 8 new Kois , 8 guests and 8 dishes of food , would complete this auspicious evening .SlySlySly

Congratulation once again on your new pond .

Cheers
David


koinutx
Koi Lover


Aug 5, 2008, 8:47 PM

Post #44 of 54 (1346 views)
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Re: [kelvinbay] New Pond [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
Hi Koinutx,

you must have some form of sixth sense !

I have ironed out all the outstanding issues and is currently making final preparations for the first batches of fishes to be introduced on 08-08-08 8pm !

I would like to take this opportunity to thank yourself, David, Acurrent01, Koi@kit, Epal63, Ouch and others who has offered so much advices without which I would have taken even more time to solve the problems.

Thanks guys !


Kelvin



Hi Kelvin,

You must be excited abt the Big day. Chosen your 8 Gems already?

btw, do you intend to have some temporary cover? I lost 2 fishes in the first 4 weeks due to jumping out!...Pirate (but my pond was much smaller.)


kelvinbay
Koi Lover

Aug 6, 2008, 11:06 PM

Post #45 of 54 (1295 views)
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Re: [koinutx] New Pond [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Koinutx,

I am certainly excited and have actually identified the 8 babies I would like to bring home first. Sad to say that I may missed the auspicious 08-08-08 as a couple of issues crop up again. I have no choice but push it a to a couple of days later. Sigh.......

As for the issue of pond cover, I have tailor-made some banners to prevent the fishes for jumping out of the pond. I will post some pictures of the pond with the banners installed and see what you guys think.

Keep you guys posted on the pond's progress.


Kelvin


Epal63
Koi Lover

Aug 25, 2008, 1:43 PM

Post #46 of 54 (960 views)
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Re: [kelvinbay] New Pond [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Kevin,

We are eager to see your koi collections. Could you please give us an update?

Thanks!


kelvinbay
Koi Lover

Aug 26, 2008, 11:10 AM

Post #47 of 54 (920 views)
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Re: [Epal63] New Pond [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Epal36,

my pond is finally up & running. I have brought back 23 pieces of my babies from the farm, the last of which was introduced last Wed 20.08, 2008 2008hr (missed the 08-08-08, my son came up with this idea of triple 2008).

The water is slightly greenish at the moment, probably due to the fact that bacteria are not fully build up yet. Also, there's lots of foam on the surface at the moment. I will post a picture of the state of the pond this evening.

As for my koi collection, I do not have much to show cause am relatively new; started serious koi keeping only in Dec 2006 when my Dainichi Showa won first prize in the Young Koi Show. Thus, my koi are mainly nisai and tosai, just a few sansai & above. Perhaps I will post some pictures of my babies later in the evening too.

I would like to once again thank you for your assistance in providing tips and advices. Pictures of pond and koi coming up........


Kelvin


koi@kit
Senior Member


Aug 26, 2008, 3:35 PM

Post #48 of 54 (896 views)
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Re: [kelvinbay] New Pond [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Kelvin,

i m glad ur pond pond is up and running... hope to visit u soon.. is the dainichi showa u mentioned got latest picture to share? thanks

rgds
kit


kelvinbay
Koi Lover

Aug 26, 2008, 10:42 PM

Post #49 of 54 (859 views)
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Re: [koi@kit] New Pond [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Kit,

Thanks. The next time u r are here, pse do let me know, I will organise a mini get-togather party and we can have lots of koi talk.

The Dainichi showa that win me my first trophy did not grow that well after the show; it fail to win anyting in subsequent shows. I shall post its pix nevertheless, on a later date.

As for now, perhaps I should post a couple of pix on my pond :




kelvinbay
Koi Lover

Aug 26, 2008, 10:58 PM

Post #50 of 54 (857 views)
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Re: [Epal63] New Pond [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Epal36,

here's another picture of my pond :



One might see some of my babies swimming near the top, though not very clear.

I will try to post pictures of some of my current favourites soon. Cheers.


Kelvin

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