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Home: KOI Talk: Pond Water Quality:
Algae Stopper 90 Kill Koi too

 





 


KMChong
Koi Lover

Jun 27, 2000, 5:33 AM

Post #1 of 22 (4680 views)
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I have added one bottle on Algae Stopper 90 which can treated 1200 litre to my 2000 litre pond. Within next three hours bad things happen to me. First of all, I drove out for a breather and the lady luck was not with me. My car tyre burst and cost me 500 bucks to change two tyres plus fixing the dent sport-rim. The next thing my wife call me telling me that I have 20 dead koi in my pond. I don't know whether is true or not, like some of the Chinese believe that koi is use to drive evil spirit away, my kois have rescued me for the car accident.

I knew that the Algae stopper 90 liquid had killed 20 of those koi with length 12" above.

I have changed 95% of the pond water and added back the pipe water which took four hours to fill up the pond. I have added 5 kg of salt and 2kg of antichorine (pellet type) into the pond. In the first hour, the rest of the koi seem to recover. However, the third hour, I saw the same symptom again where all the koi floating and trying to find for space to inhale oxygen from the place near the waterfall. I have to change water again and this time I pump all the water from the lower pond which I use to rare non koi fishes and then added 30% of pipe water. My neighbour thought I am crazy because this process ended nearly 3:30 am the next day. I only slept two hours and quickly woke up at

Luckily, the remaining kois have survived for the second time.

Can anyone have the same bad experience using the Algae Stopper 90?


Mark
Koi Kichi

Jun 27, 2000, 8:15 AM

Post #2 of 22 (4680 views)
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Hi
Are you able to provide me with the chemical concentration that comes with the bottle?

It seems obvious to me that the chemical that was introduced into your pond has ended up burning the gills of your fish. Check the gills by lifting the gill cover - the normal color should be nice red color and nicely formed. Otherwise you should find see the lighter color (eg. light red to pink) with some parts near the tips of the gills turned white. If this is the case your fish are cooked.
Next you may want to test the Dissolved oxygen in your pond. These are usually the 2 contributing factors for dying fish when chemicals are added.

Lastly, satisfy yourself that the water parameters are within tolerance. Good if you can also provide this added info. Thanks.

Good luck.

(This post was edited by Mark Richman on Mar 6, 2002, 3:00 PM)


KMChong
Koi Lover

Jun 28, 2000, 12:04 AM

Post #3 of 22 (4680 views)
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The water seem to be acidic because I felt burning reaction when I jumped into the pond to take out those dead fishes. The smell of the water was terrible.

The dead fishes did not show the symptom of burning gill. I can't find the red color around the gill which you have mentioned.

I will post the chemical concentration to you later. However, as far as I remember it did stated that I capful for 5 litres and the whole bottle can treat 1200 litres. Therefore, I poured the whole bottle for my 2000 litres pond.



Mark
Koi Kichi

Jun 28, 2000, 12:28 AM

Post #4 of 22 (4680 views)
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Hi

Quote
"I can't find the red color around the gill which you have mentioned".
You got to lift the gill cover to see the gill. They should be red in color and not just around the gill.




dttk
Senior Member

Jun 28, 2000, 11:31 PM

Post #5 of 22 (4680 views)
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Dear Chong, is it possible that you may NOT have added the whole bottle gradually by diluting a small portion at a time and distributing it across the whole pond? It is possible that some of the koi were exposed to the concentrated chemical directly at the spot where you introduced the chemical.


Melvin Tan
Koi Lover

Jun 29, 2000, 3:02 AM

Post #6 of 22 (4680 views)
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Hi,

when I changed to a new filter at the end of last year, I used this same stuff to clear the green water.

Applied as per recommended dose and in 10 minutes 2 of of my 55 cm koi started to flash like crazy. The mixture was added evenly. I immediately did a 50 percent water change and the 2 koi were ok thereafter. Never did use this stuff anymore thereafter.

Cheers!


Anonymous
Anonymous

Jun 29, 2000, 12:00 PM

Post #7 of 22 (4680 views)
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The active ingredient stated on the bottle:
2-Chloro-4.5 bis (ethylamino) -1,3,5-triazine

Anyone here has a good knowledge in chemistry. Can't figure what is all that about.

regards
Swee


Edward Low
Koi Lover

Jun 30, 2000, 2:23 AM

Post #8 of 22 (4680 views)
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I have used the algae stopper before and never had any problems. Only thing is that you need to make sure the chemical is white and not turned yellow which has got a sour smell. I noticed that the bottle will deteriorate if exposed to sunlight. Therefore pls. check colour of chemical before introducing to pond.


Dr Darby
Koi Lover

Jul 5, 2000, 12:52 AM

Post #9 of 22 (4680 views)
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Some of you may be ignorant about the use of many chemicals. Many did not know that some of these reacts negatively in acidic water while others in alkalic condition. So the safe way to test them in a small quanitity outside the pond.

Dr Darby
Curator


KMChong
Koi Lover

Jul 5, 2000, 1:32 AM

Post #10 of 22 (4680 views)
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Dear Mark,

Sorry for no posting back earlier due to I was on a business trip last week and just came back yesterday.

Thanks to Swee because he already posted the chemical components. The active ingredient stated on the bottle:
2-Chloro-4.5 bis (ethylamino) -1,3,5-triazine

Thanks for dttk reply. I should not pour the whole bottle at one time.

Just gone for a week and my pond water had turned totally green in colour.


Mark
Koi Kichi

Jul 5, 2000, 11:03 AM

Post #11 of 22 (4680 views)
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Hi Chong
I doubtful about your pond. Let's trouble shoot from here and hope you don't mind me asking:

1. How long have got the pond built?
2. How long have you been in this hobby?
3. What are the current water parameters - pH, ammonia, nitrites and nitrates?

Let's go back to basic.


itdmraa
Koi Lover

Jul 5, 2000, 11:55 AM

Post #12 of 22 (4680 views)
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Quote
Originally posted by KMChong:

The active ingredient stated on the bottle:
2-Chloro-4.5 bis (ethylamino) -1,3,5-triazine

The ingredient consists of ethyl-maminobenzoate methanesulfonate and metacaine which are toxic to fish if used in direct sunlight or salt water.


KMChong
Koi Lover

Jul 6, 2000, 12:25 AM

Post #13 of 22 (4680 views)
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Dear Mark,

The pond is 14 months old and recently (two months ago) I have added the bottom drain and a new filter which consist of seven segments. However, it is under direct sunshine. I will going to put the black garden net to cover the pond in next two week.

I have been rearing aquarium fishes for quite some time and only the last one year plus started to keep koi in the pond. I have been a frequent visitor to this website site.

I have added Pond Block into the pond before I went for my business trip. I have added salt and Sodium Bicarbonate into the pond too.

The ammonia reading acceptable according to the test kit. I do not have a test kit for the pH, nitrites and nitrates. Any recommendation.




Mark
Koi Kichi

Jul 6, 2000, 3:20 AM

Post #14 of 22 (4680 views)
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Quote
by KMChong: ....The pond is 14 months old and recently (two months ago) I have added the bottom drain and a new filter which consist of seven segments. However, it is under direct sunshine. I will going to put the black garden net to cover the pond in next two week.
OK, now we are getting near the problems. The bottom drain sounds great but your new filter has not kick. It takes 3 to 7 weeks for full colonization to occur. Got to have lots of patience. Do not over stock. Do not add any chemical to remove algae 'cos it wouldn't work. Look up some of the tips under the topics *General* and *pond water quality*. Lots of information on *howto* jump start a filter system and stocking. You have to keep changing some water daily till the problem green goes away. By the way, green water does not mean bad so long the water quality is checked constantly. By the way what is the size of your filter system for your 2000 litres pond?

Quote
I have added Pond Block into the pond before I went for my business trip. I have added salt and Sodium Bicarbonate into the pond too. The ammonia reading acceptable according to the test kit. I do not have a test kit for the pH, nitrites and nitrates. Any recommendation.
Pond block is good and generally a 30% sunlight is sufficient to develops the color of your koi. Sodium bicarbonate is a good move for O2 buffering. As for your ammonia test kit, we needed some reading. If test kit says acceptable range, then I will conclude that its a inferior one. Go get a better one. Other test kits for nitrites and nitrates is a MUST! Reputable names like *Tetra* has good test kits.

Please check up "First Aid box for koi" under the topic *Medicine*. Those items under discussions are worth considering to carry them.

Good luck.


(This post was edited by Mark Richman on May 7, 2000, 2:00 PM)


KMChong
Koi Lover

Jul 6, 2000, 3:32 AM

Post #15 of 22 (4680 views)
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Dear Mark,

The "2000 litres" was based solely on the word from the contractor.

What will be the exact formula for the calculation for the pond volume and pond filter?


Mark
Koi Kichi

Jul 6, 2000, 11:25 AM

Post #16 of 22 (4680 views)
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You can find the maths here.


Khoobg
Webmaster


Jul 6, 2000, 1:47 PM

Post #17 of 22 (4680 views)
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Hi Frank

If your pond is of irregular shape, just purchase a flow meter from the hardware shop and install this flowmeter on the pipe linking the water main to your pond. The next time you decide to change your pond water, check the reading on the flowmeter that will give you value in M3 ( ton ). Do measure the water depth before and after filling so that you can work out the pond volume accordingly. 1m3 = 1 ton or 1000kg


Ken Sutanto
Koi Lover

Jul 7, 2000, 10:20 AM

Post #18 of 22 (4680 views)
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Dear Mark and Khoo,

How to calculate the filter capacity. Let say if I have rectangular shape of filter 1 x 5 x 1 mtrs depth so it is 5 cu.mtrs equal to 5 tons but filter is heavily fill with green mat. so the volume of water actually is much less than 5 tons. When we want to have a chemical or salt treatment. We will tends to overdose if we take the volume of filter is 5 tons. This came to question when I finish and fill my filter with water then I put in the filter mat so the water surface is going up. Can I understand that when treat chemical we should based on the volume water only which by above explanation will be less than 5 tons ?

Regards,
Ken


KMChong
Koi Lover

Jul 8, 2000, 7:34 AM

Post #19 of 22 (4680 views)
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Dear Mark,

According to your formula, the pond volume is 2,835 US Gallons and the filter volume is 540 US Gallons.

I think I might have problem with the filter right because it is less that 30% of the pond volume.


Khoobg
Webmaster


Jul 8, 2000, 7:44 AM

Post #20 of 22 (4680 views)
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Hello Frank,

Rule of thumb states that the surface area of the filter (Bio) must be at least 30% of the pond surface area. While the main pond can be deeper at 5 feet or more whereas the filter may just go to up to three feet deep. Deeper filter will not contribute to better filtering effect.

Hence you need to reculcuate again to confirm whether your filter is of sufficient size or not.



Khoobg
Webmaster


Jul 8, 2000, 2:03 PM

Post #21 of 22 (4680 views)
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Hi Ken,

When you obtain your pond volume by calculation, then it is definitely an estimation. But then this estimation is good enough for most medication.

Best way is still to record the volume by the use of flowmeter which is of course more accurate.



Mark
Koi Kichi

Jul 9, 2000, 1:11 PM

Post #22 of 22 (4680 views)
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Quote
Originally posted by KMChong:
.....According to your formula, the pond volume is 2,835 US Gallons and the filter volume is 540 US Gallons.

I think I might have problem with the filter right because it is less that 30% of the pond volume.
It's not 30% of pond volume. Read the upper post by Mr Khoobg on filter size.


 
 
 



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