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Filter cleaning

Adrian Lee
Koi Lover

Oct 28, 2001, 6:34 AM

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Dear all,

Could any gentlement or lady advise that how often should a filter normally be cleaned?

I heard from one of the friend who rear Kois that he only clean up the filter once a year. However, he does change 5% of the pond water daily.

Could someone advise if daily change of pond water is necessary if the Kois remain healthy?

johnson lee
Koi Kichi

Oct 28, 2001, 8:05 AM

Post #2 of 22 (5275 views)
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Hi Adrian

Welcome to the Forum!

Well, the issue of filter cleaning depends on lots of factors.

If you have a very well-planned fish pond ie. with bottom drains, mid-drains, uni-rings and your pond is lightly stocked, then cleaning the filter may occur once a year as your friend did.

However, it is not good practice to clean your filter only annually no matter how efficient or well designed the pond is.

I cleaned mine once every week but not the whole filter at once otherwise you will kill all the good bacteria!

I clean the 1st chamber that contains black brushes weekly as this is where all the large debris and dirt are trapped. I also cleaned the 2nd chamber once every fortnight. But the chambers where the good bacteria resides I only clean them if they are very dirty and if there is a strong fishy smell. That means dirt and sludge may have accumulated. Whenever you wash your filter media, please do not use tap water, otherwise all the good bacteria will die, use the pond water.

You need not change water daily unless your water parameters are not good. I change about 10% on a weekly basis.

I hope this helps you in a small way! Happy koi-keeping!

Regards

Johnson

(This post was edited by jtklee on Mar 10, 2003, 3:00 PM)

Adrian Lee
Koi Lover

Oct 29, 2001, 7:00 AM

Post #3 of 22 (5275 views)
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Hi, Johnson :

Thanks for yout precious advice and time to share your knowledge. I am really appreciate it.

As you know, most of the green koi fans are alike... worrying about their ponds and kois. Following lots of belief which they got it from friends, books and other media. However, it is just not enough.

I and my dad have built a 3000 gallon pond on our own.. quite impressive Smile

but we have been worrying over the water quality until recently. The water was greenish b4 but after our effort to cultivate the Bio-filter system, the water has turned into "Diamond Water" now Smile

Johnson, I need one more favour from you. Hope that you are not sick about answering ****** question like this... Smile

. I have been testing the PH, Amonia adn Nitrite level weekly. The Amonia and Nitrite level seems to be well maintained because of the bacterial and the plant we grow somewhere in the waterfall and filter system. However, The PH is, I think, more than 8.0 as the water in my test tube is as deep as the colour shown in the indicator sample. I am a bit worried as I dont know what is the cause of it and how do I go about controling the PH of my pond water. Wish that somebody can advise on this.. Thank you!!

TonyG
Koi Lover

Oct 29, 2001, 10:46 PM

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Hi Adrian

PH 8 or even 9 is OK. My pond is at PH 8 since the day i set up my small FG pond and it has been around for ~1yr. So no need to change anything.

To maintain the PH, what you need is to buffer it. Can achieve by having corals (about 10kg) at the last compartment of your filter chamber and/or increased the KH of the water by adding baking powder. This way, you can have less worries about PH fluctuation.

Tony

johnson lee
Koi Kichi

Oct 30, 2001, 12:21 PM

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Hi Adrian

Sorry I did not reply earlier. I was on leave today and did not log on until now.

No need to apologise over the need to ask questions. We are here to help whenever possible. Smile

Regarding your pH of >8, just as Tony has mentioned (Hi Tony!), no worries. Koi thrives well in pH of between 6.8-8.6. Some say even 9. I prefer to maintain it at 7.5-8.0. You need not do anything presently as the parameter is fine.

However if the pH rises above 9, you may then want to consider adding a minimum of 0.1% salt solution to your pond. This is because if your pond has traces of ammonia/nitrite, it will be even more toxic to your fish compared to a pH of say 7.

Hope this is helpful! Have a nice day!

Regards
Johnson

Note: Adrian, Tony meant adding baking soda (as in sodium bicarbonate) and not baking powder. I think it was a typographical error. Cheers!

(This post was edited by jtklee on May 10, 2003, 2:00 PM)

Adrian Lee
Koi Lover

Oct 30, 2001, 1:49 PM

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Thank you so much, veterans!! Your sharings have chased away my worries!!

TQ!!

TonyG
Koi Lover

Oct 30, 2001, 10:55 PM

Post #7 of 22 (5275 views)
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Hi Johnson

Blind me, how can i make such a mistake?? [redface]
Thanks for correcting.

Cheers

Tony

johnson lee
Koi Kichi

Oct 31, 2001, 12:38 AM

Post #8 of 22 (5275 views)
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Hi Adrian

Just a matter of curiousity, perhaps you could tell us more about your new pond! Is it made of concrete or fibreglass? What are the dimensions? How many kois do you have and the sizes? What are your water readings? ie. ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, pH and KH (carbonate hardness)

This will give the forum members a better idea of things in order to assist you.

Have a nice day!

Cheers!
Johnson

And Tony, no worries man, I am sure it was just a slip of the mind! I know you meant to say, baking soda. Smile

Adrian Lee
Koi Lover

Oct 31, 2001, 1:30 PM

Post #9 of 22 (5275 views)
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Hi Johnson,

Its more than excited for me to tell you all about my new ponds, as I really overwhelmed by the colourful dolphins in my pond and the overall laid of it. Smile

The pond is 12.8ft long, 8ft wide and 4.5ft deep. It should contain about 3000 gallon of water. The filter is about 40% of its size as advised by my master (a book i bought from MPH). It was a shame that I did not visit this site b4 the construction and I only know the trickle filter is much better in controlling Amonia and Nitrite level without depending on plants and filter mats.

There are only 4 compartment in my filter. Firstly is the settlement with about 20 over blushes and followed by the 2nd compartment in which I have placed in the filter mats and bigger rocks beneath them. The 3rd compartment contains corals, medium rocks and sand-like rocks. The final compartment is cleared except a submersible pump, while a pair of 20W ultra-violet light are exposed to the water directly.

A 3.5ft waterfall and a parallel pipe along the side of the pond creates sufficient (i think) O2 fo my babies. Therefore, no Hi-blow is installed. No dead corner as it is exactly a U-shape pond.

There are about 40 of them now and size ranging from 3 inches to 12 inches. I can see a few of them growing rapidly (about 1 - 2 inch after a month). Most of them are not really pure breed. They can be few generation of MBJ or Taiwanese breed. However, a few of them like Showa, Kohaku and Tancho Sanke look very potential to be pretty chics in the future. Smile

These kois i got it from Johor Jaya at RM100 each after negotiating with the boss. Originally is RM150 each. They are all about 6 inches long.

The Showa has too many black marking on the body but the thing i like is that it has a ligtning-like black marking on the head, not not fully developed. Smile

So, Johnson! Wish to read your comments soon. Thanks in advance first Smile

** Has anyone got any idea where is the best koi trader in JB? More of honest and sell quality koi at reasonable price Smile

Econ seems to suffer for another 2 years or more.. so have to tighten up our belt! Smile

Rgds, Adrian.

jerrylim
Koi Lover

Oct 31, 2001, 2:43 PM

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Dear Adrian,
Glad to see someone from the same kampung in this forum. Have you heard of a koi farm in Plentong. Boss is one Mr Ang - very nice chap. He breeds Malaysian Borned Japanese koi as well as imports Japanese koi. In fact, they are making my odd-shaped fibre koi tank. However, the access is quite remote and it took me more than 3 tries before I found my way inside. Its in the middle of some oil palm / rubber estate. I will be visiting him everyday for the next couple of days to monitor the construction of my little pond.
If you are keen - we can actually go together. Call me on my mobile at 019 7789 451.

johnson lee
Koi Kichi

Nov 1, 2001, 1:24 AM

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Hi Adrian!

Wow, from your description, you've got a really nice and large pond for a first-timer!

40 beautiful babies! I can imagine sitting there all day long just gazing into the water and listening to the soothing flow of water.....better than going to Langkawi! Smile

I am sure, Joshua (the forum's senior member) will agree with me on this.

Do you have bottom drains for your ponds for the easy discharge of fish poop and other decaying debris?

By the way, it is not too late to install a trickle tower (TT) for your pond. Since your last chamber is basically empty, you can put a small pump in there and divert some water into the TT which can be housed beside your pond. You can obtain more info about TT from this link: http://www.koi.com.my/ubb/Forum4/HTML/000067.html

Perhaps one day when I am down in Johor, I can drop by and visit your pond.

Happy koi-keeping!

Cheers and regards
Johnson

Adrian Lee
Koi Lover

Nov 1, 2001, 12:42 PM

Post #12 of 22 (5275 views)
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Hi Jerry!!

I think I had been the fish farm that you mentioned before. Its actually Kempas area!! Somewhere near Starhill Resort. It was just recently opened!! I actually bought some of my kois from that farm.. Not really cheap if you are talking about those MBJ. 6 inches are about RM350-RM500. I got a Taiwanese Hikarimuji of 12" for RM150. Body is ok but there is black marking on the head though nicely placed. I recently got 3 MBJ in Johor Jaya for RM100 each... they are pretty!
A potential to be gigantic! You know NanYang in Kulai? Kois there are even more expensive..4" can cost you RM350 each!! I will call you soon! Smile

Anyway, are you the Jerry working in Stock Broking firm? plays bowling?

Hi Johnson!! I dont think the TT is not possible as the last chamber of my filter is occupied by a submersible pump which sucks the water to the top of the waterfall.

My pond has bottom drain and pond wall is painted with numerous layer of fibre. Now the wall and some part of the waterfall has been occupied by Algae.. dont know if they are good algae. They are not those cotton-like algae but its getting thicker and stick on the wall and rocks. An so-called expert (Hey!! Jerry, he is Mr. Tan from the farm you mentioned) advised me to kill those algae with drugs 1st then only the good cotton-like algae will bloom. I have no idea if his statement is reliable as some friends of mine told me that people from that farm is not realible!! Frown

Can Johnson indicate some direction?

Rgds.
I

jerrylim
Koi Lover

Nov 1, 2001, 1:52 PM

Post #13 of 22 (5275 views)
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Adrian,
I have heard about the one in Kempas - thay take their supply from this Plentong farm. This guy I am refering to is Mr Ang.
Not many people go direct to this fam because he is a very low profile guy and access is quite difficult.
Nanyang - their prices are crazy and not very honest. My first local kois was purchased from them. 12 inch white colour cost me Rm25-00 (at that time don't even know what is a kohaku.) Went again the following week and saw that they were having a sale - guess how much he wants to charge me .. Rm35-00
I swear I will never buy anything from them ever. No I don't work in a stock broking firm. I run an advertising agency business in JB.

johnson lee
Koi Kichi

Nov 2, 2001, 12:12 AM

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Hi Adrian

It is a sunny day here in KL so I am putting on my shades! Smile

Well, can't comment much about koi dealers in Johor so I'll leave that part of the discussion to both Jerry and yourself. Smile

About the TT, you have 2 options if you still want to build a TT to reduce nitrite/nitrates.

a. Divert some water from your pump ie. by using a 'T' joint and channel it to the TT which you can house beside the pond.

b. If diverting will reduce the strength of your pump, I still recommend installing a small pump (and I mean small, just good enough to pump water into TT) for your TT. Unless you are saying there is even no space for a very small pump.

As for the algae, if it is greenish/blackish in colour and grows all over your pond walls, bottom, waterfall, rocks etc.. they are good guys. Do not scrub them off as they will assist in 'eating' up the fish waste which produces ammonia, nitrite and so on.

Have a nice day and happy koi-keeping!

Rgds
Johnson

Adrian Lee
Koi Lover

Nov 2, 2001, 10:37 AM

Post #15 of 22 (5275 views)
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Thanks a lot!! Johnson Smile

You've been very helpful and nv get bored to my repeated question Smile

Really happy to know that those algae are good guys like you!! As for the TT, I may have to restructure my garden layout so as to fit it nicely. If you come down to JB, remember to pay me as well as my babies a visit and let me be the host!!
email me at adrian1@tm.net.my.

And Jerry, I think I know that Mr. Ang as there is only one Mr. Ang, so far as I know, running Koi farm in JB. The farm entrance is situated on a uphill of the road to Silong rite?? And the main entrance there, they display a lot of "Lohan" fish rite? Then you have to work down numerous staircase before you can reach the bigger koi pond near an artificial pon. The ponds are covered with black net rite? I think that is the one. If not you may correct me! Today, I just heard from my dad that there is a reputable koi farm in Senai... Sunday is going to look for it!! Smile

Hope to get 1 or 2 really good babies there as I want them to stay in a more spacious pond to grow faster! Smile

Keep you inform when I got the exact location!!

See you guys!! Rgds.

TonyG
Koi Lover

Nov 2, 2001, 10:51 PM

Post #16 of 22 (5275 views)
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Hi Adrian

I don't think you need to restructure your garden layout to have a TT, you can make use of your waterfall. What you can do is before the water flows to the waterfall, place some biohome. This will be some form of TT for you. But if your water is good and you are able to maintain it, than TT is juat a suppliment.

Ciao

Tony

40 kois in a pond, dream on Tony dream on..... Wink

johnson lee
Koi Kichi

Nov 3, 2001, 6:35 AM

Post #17 of 22 (5275 views)
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Hi Adrian/Tony

Thanks for the invitation Adrian and if and when I am down in JB, will give you a shout and visit your pond.

Tony, well it is good to dream, because when we dare to dream, we work towards achieving it! I am already dreaming of a super large pond for my future house. I will incorporate all the best elements of a modern pond into it and at the same time make it as natural a layout as possible. It will have at least 3 bottom drains, 2 mid-drains, bubble bead filter, protein skimmers, trickle towers, waterfall, etc etc Well, I can afford to dream.....no cost involved! Wink

Anyway, have a nice weekend everyone!

Rgds
Johnson

Adrian Lee
Koi Lover

Nov 5, 2001, 2:06 PM

Post #18 of 22 (5275 views)
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Hi Johnson!! Its me again! Smile

I got confused when I read your posted mail here... What are the Protein Skimmer and Bubble bead filter for? I cant find it on those reference books i bought. Perhaps you may give me a very brief picture.

And yesterday, I went to a really fantastic koi farm in JB. There were lots of pretty jumbo babies in their pond.. I even found Tancho Asagi, Koromo, Kawarimono...lots of them. Most of them are about 30" and above. I bought a Hikarimoyo (8") for RM350 and a Tancho Showa (no scales) of 7" for RM280. Was is reasonable? I even intended to buy a Asagi but its really expensive!! A 4 " small koi priced at RM400!! Terrible!!

Really tranquil environment then water is so nice without a single bubble on top of it. Not like mine, perhaps partly due to waterfall, bubble is all around. Is there any effective method to solve it immediately pal?

Hope to read your guidance soon Smile

Rgds.

johnson lee
Koi Kichi

Nov 8, 2001, 6:00 AM

Post #19 of 22 (5275 views)
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Hi Adrian

For more info on bubble bead filter and protein skimmer, pls. look up these links.
a. http://www.koivet.com/bbf1.htm
b. http://www.koi.com.my/ubb/Forum3/HTML/000128.html

As for the prices of the koi, well it is difficult to say what is expensive and what is not! It depends on the bloodline, the body conformation, patterns etc. However, for our level, if the koi appeals to us and if we feel comfortable with the price then I supposed that is a good buy! Pretty subjective matter! Wink

Anyway, the prices that you mentioned, if they are Japanese kois, then I reckoned it is quite reasonable in price.

It is also impossible to have calm, tranquil water in a koi pond simply because you need the water to be constantly 'moving' ie. with waterfall, venturis, airstones etc to provide adequate oxygen for the kois.

My definition of calm and tranquility is in the context of the human mind, where one is soothed by the sounds of running water and observing the kois swimming ever so gracefully......ooooohhhhh so peaceful. Smile

Therefore, do not try and hope for a still water pond, not good for the fishes. I switch off my airstone pump whenever I want to have a clearer view of the kois but just for a while only.

Rgds
Johnson

Joshua Lee
Koi Lover

Nov 8, 2001, 8:02 AM

Post #20 of 22 (5275 views)
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Thanks Johnson for the link on the amazing bubble bead filter. Looks really good. Would need a pretty deep pocket to install it together with the mandatory UV filter if not already bankrupt trying to built a 3000 gallon pond like Adrian and his Dad's.

Kudos Adrian, for having a nice set up. Enjoy your water babies!

Best regards
[biggrin]
Josh

Tazul Adzhar Ishak
Deleted

Nov 12, 2001, 1:24 PM

Post #21 of 22 (5275 views)
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Hi JTKLee,

Hope u still can remember me, I have followed your advised on arranging the mechanical & bio filters.
Thanks its working very well without trickle filter.The water is cristal clear now after 3weeks in green pea soup..

BUT the algae is starting growing on the wall. Suggest me either to retain the algae or remove it away. Seem like the kois are happily eating the algae. Is there any side effect to the fish.

regards.

johnson lee
Koi Kichi

Nov 13, 2001, 12:25 AM

Post #22 of 22 (5275 views)
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Hi Tazul!

Good to hear that your pond water is crystal clear! Smile

Keep it up. However, if you have not done so, you have to regularly check the water parameters to ensure that your kois are living in good, clean water. Compulsory test kit include pH test, ammonia, nitrite and KH (carbonate hardness). If you want, you can also include the nitrates and Dissolved Oxygen test kit.

The greenish/blackish algae growing on the side and bottom of your pond are good stuff. Please do not scrub them off as they form an essential part of the health of your pond and your kois. The algae helps in the nitrogen cycle process as well and your kois will benefit from the foraging of the algae! You will see them always nibbling and scouring the pond for the algae.

Happy koi-keeping!

Rgds
Johnson

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