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lamig747
User


Sep 20, 2009, 2:49 AM

Post #1 of 33 (7196 views)
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Snail Pest Can't Post

Hi Guys,

Wanted to know how any of you got rid of snail pests. They're multiplying in my filters and waterfall fast. The kois also love to eat them but afraid it may harbor some disease. I'm attaching a picture so you can understand what they are - normally less than 1 cm in length.

Hope you can share your wisdom.

Tnx
Loren



(This post was edited by thiamhwa on Sep 20, 2009, 5:34 PM)


raistlin
User

Sep 20, 2009, 5:44 AM

Post #2 of 33 (7179 views)
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Re: [lamig747] Snail Pest [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Bro Lamig,

No experience with snails, but I can imagine the koi would love crunching on those. Good calcium source too. Tongue The other forum-ers might have experience.

Cheers!



DavidSoon
Veteran


Sep 20, 2009, 9:28 AM

Post #3 of 33 (7162 views)
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Re: [lamig747] Snail Pest [In reply to] Can't Post

Good day Brother Loren SmileSmile

These Snail slugs thrive in " rich fattening water " .. normally from ponds that exercise heavy feeding with high protein food .
The presence of these snails indicated that you have "rich fattening water " ...SlySly .

They can be harmless to our kois , but the shells are good place to harbour parasites as well .
Bacteria and parasites from bird shit can find their way into these shells and when they're hatched within , they will find their way into the pond water and to our fishes ..SlySly

One easy way to reduce their population , is by administering Dimilin , together with Refresh Powder at the same . Dose Refresh powder 3 days later , and at the end of the 5 days , you might have to "cleanse" your filteration chmabers ...SlySly You will find all the empty shells all over the filteration mats and floors ...SlySly

Bearing in mind , you can reduce the population drastically , but will never be able to exterminate them totally .

Just my 2 cents ,..SlySly Hope this help ..

David


lamig747
User


Sep 20, 2009, 2:07 PM

Post #4 of 33 (7148 views)
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Re: [DavidSoon] Snail Pest [In reply to] Can't Post

THanks guys. Tried OPs to no effect. Will try the physical approach- that is plucking each. Aside from these snails, I have a problem w mosquitoes/midges (also in the filter). Will try to put in mosquito fishes and see if that will take care of the problem.


DavidSoon
Veteran


Sep 20, 2009, 6:33 PM

Post #5 of 33 (7128 views)
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Re: [lamig747] Snail Pest [In reply to] Can't Post

Brother Loren ..SmileSmile

Dimilin + Refresh Powder is friendly for fishes , but is lethal to Snails and water mozzies at the same time .
1 doses of dimilin + refresh , is good enough to kill the snails and 2 dose of this is good enough to drastically reduce the population to almost zero , except for those outside the "water" .. refering to those that's outside the water .. during this process , water mozzies are drastically reduced as well , and a 3rd dose of Refres Powder , is good enough to eliminate the mozzies population for a long time ..SmileSmile

Hope this help .

Cheers
David


larz1
Veteran


Sep 21, 2009, 5:28 PM

Post #6 of 33 (7056 views)
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Re: [DavidSoon] Snail Pest [In reply to] Can't Post

Take David's good advice, but as he said, don't expect them all to disappear permanently. They are HARDY little things.
A few of them made their way into one of our ponds several years ago on some plants my wife gotUnsure Koi do eat them voraciously, but they can and will hide in places where the Koi cannot reach, and they are so tiny in the early stages that you can even come to believe they are gone.
A few years ago we brought some eggs in to hatch in an indoor aquarium tank, along with some mature media for a submerged filter. There were no signs of snails on the media. Within a matter of weeks the walls of the tank were swarming with hundreds of snails that had hatched from the media and of course the fry were too small to eat them. As the fry grew larger I began scraping snails from the walls of the tank, crushing them, and feeding them to the fryWink Needless to say the fry growth accelerated rapidly from the "free" high protein foodCool and as they grew large enough they began eating them without my assistanceCoolCoolCool. There soon were zero visible snails in the tankSmile, but they are still thereFrown I can assure you that if I EVER let the population of fish in that tank drop to zero there will be an explosion of snails until they use up all food resources in the water and bacterial colony on the submerged mediaTongue


KoiAnswers
Koi Kichi

Sep 21, 2009, 7:26 PM

Post #7 of 33 (7039 views)
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Re: [lamig747] Snail Pest [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
THanks guys. Tried OPs to no effect. Will try the physical approach- that is plucking each. Aside from these snails, I have a problem w mosquitoes/midges (also in the filter). Will try to put in mosquito fishes and see if that will take care of the problem.


Hi Bro Loren,
If you are from Malaysia, I can direct you to the right place to buy the stuff that will get right of the problems that you are facing now. This will be an alternative to the ones suggested by Bro David.

I had a really bad infestation of Midgets in my filter chambers before. I have had thousands of them every morning, even though I used my vacuum cleaner to suck them out of the filter and the air. I tried Dimilin, the amount was reduced initially but almost immediately, came back ever stronger with increase numbers. I have almost given up with the Midget infestation until someone recommended to me this medication (a formulation from Japan). He said that the dealer guarantied that the Midgets will be wiped off. I bought the medication (liquid orange in color) for RM298 for 4 liters. The dosage was at 50ml per metric tonne, and the dosage is for a 6 days treatment. The Midgets were wiped out almost immediately. I said to myself.......woow! Too good to be true!!! And today, it is more than 2 months and two weeks after the treatment and still not a midget insect in sight........it really worked! Not only that! The snails (which I never knew they existed in my pond, were floating and dying everywhere.........Even the murky, dirty stuff from the bottom of my filters and the pond bottoms started to be dislodged and ended up in the filter chambers. I believe this is a strong stuff, but it worked. These are my observations pertaining to the behavior of my kois. Some of the kois gulped air quite a bit for the first day, the gulping lessen for the second day, and reduced for the third and forth days. Almost no gulping for the 5th and 6th days. This medication even kill gills and body flukes........So far, there is no medication that I know that is like IT.

If you are interested, I will guide you to the dealer that is selling the medication. This is THE PARASITE KILLER for me.........and that is the name of the medication. SlySlySly

Regards,


murphys33
Novice

Sep 27, 2009, 2:34 AM

Post #8 of 33 (6787 views)
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Re: [msms] Snail Pest [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To

In Reply To
THanks guys. Tried OPs to no effect. Will try the physical approach- that is plucking each. Aside from these snails, I have a problem w mosquitoes/midges (also in the filter). Will try to put in mosquito fishes and see if that will take care of the problem.


Hi Bro Loren,
If you are from Malaysia, I can direct you to the right place to buy the stuff that will get right of the problems that you are facing now. This will be an alternative to the ones suggested by Bro David.

I had a really bad infestation of Midgets in my filter chambers before. I have had thousands of them every morning, even though I used my vacuum cleaner to suck them out of the filter and the air. I tried Dimilin, the amount was reduced initially but almost immediately, came back ever stronger with increase numbers. I have almost given up with the Midget infestation until someone recommended to me this medication (a formulation from Japan). He said that the dealer guarantied that the Midgets will be wiped off. I bought the medication (liquid orange in color) for RM298 for 4 liters. The dosage was at 50ml per metric tonne, and the dosage is for a 6 days treatment. The Midgets were wiped out almost immediately. I said to myself.......woow! Too good to be true!!! And today, it is more than 2 months and two weeks after the treatment and still not a midget insect in sight........it really worked! Not only that! The snails (which I never knew they existed in my pond, were floating and dying everywhere.........Even the murky, dirty stuff from the bottom of my filters and the pond bottoms started to be dislodged and ended up in the filter chambers. I believe this is a strong stuff, but it worked. These are my observations pertaining to the behavior of my kois. Some of the kois gulped air quite a bit for the first day, the gulping lessen for the second day, and reduced for the third and forth days. Almost no gulping for the 5th and 6th days. This medication even kill gills and body flukes........So far, there is no medication that I know that is like IT.

If you are interested, I will guide you to the dealer that is selling the medication. This is THE PARASITE KILLER for me.........and that is the name of the medication. SlySlySly

Regards,



lamig747
User


Sep 28, 2009, 7:26 AM

Post #9 of 33 (6724 views)
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Re: [murphys33] Snail Pest [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Shukri and murphys33,

This product sounds interesting. As Im from manila, would you know the generic name of this Parasite Killer? If I dont find it here, maybe Ill try to find it in one of my trips to westport. Are there dealers near Sunway?

Rgds
loren


KoiAnswers
Koi Kichi

Sep 28, 2009, 8:24 AM

Post #10 of 33 (6720 views)
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Re: [lamig747] Snail Pest [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Loren,
The dealer Hua May is not actually very near to Sun Way, but if you are sure coming to Malaysia one of these days, I will give you the full contact and address of the place. The medication is 4 liters for RM298. In the meantime, probably you can try to dose your pond with 0.5 to 0.6% salt, let it soak for 4 to 5 days and see whether the snails will die off.
I know that snails do not like NACL which is salt.

Cheers,


lamig747
User


Sep 28, 2009, 3:04 PM

Post #11 of 33 (6692 views)
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Re: [msms] Snail Pest [In reply to] Can't Post

Will surely get in touch w you when in town.

tnx


KoiAnswers
Koi Kichi

Sep 28, 2009, 5:53 PM

Post #12 of 33 (6673 views)
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Re: [lamig747] Snail Pest [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
Will surely get in touch w you when in town.

tnx


Hi Loren,
Better still, when you are in KL, just let me know, I will fetch you and bring you to Hua May. That way, you do not need to waste time figuring how to find the place. Sly

Cheers,


lamig747
User


Sep 29, 2009, 1:47 PM

Post #13 of 33 (6633 views)
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Re: [msms] Snail Pest [In reply to] Can't Post

 
Tambe, Nandre. I will keep ur kind offer in mind. Maybe share travails as well luck in this hobby.


dheensay
User


Sep 30, 2009, 12:26 PM

Post #14 of 33 (6598 views)
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Re: [lamig747] Snail Pest [In reply to] Can't Post

What about frogs. Its innevitable that they will be around the pond. And from my understanding, they can create a lot of harm...carrying parasites.

Is there a sureshot way of keeping them away?

KAAJ

www.dheensay.com for casual outdoor & banquet furniture!


CH
User

Oct 6, 2009, 9:26 AM

Post #15 of 33 (6507 views)
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Re: [msms] Snail Pest [In reply to] Can't Post

Dear Bro Shukri,
My wife hated the midgets so much so that I have nettings covering all my filter chambers and its really troublesome to remove them whenever I need to do anything to the filter. Furthermore, the nettings get real dirty very fast with all the dead midgets.
Do they sell the "Parasite Killer" in a nursery or in our normal koi farm?
Any Bros know where we can get them in Singapore?

Thanks a million for this wonderful information, now I don't have to spend my time everynight to try to kill those irritating midgets that escape from the filter chambers.


Koi Koi
User

Oct 7, 2009, 5:20 AM

Post #16 of 33 (6464 views)
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Re: [CH] Snail Pest [In reply to] Can't Post

Dear CH,

Instead of nettings, why not use mosquito screen?

You can buy aluminium screens from hardware stores and cut them to size to fit the filter. They sure will be easier to remove and clean compared to nettings.

Regards,
Koi Koi


CH
User

Oct 7, 2009, 5:28 AM

Post #17 of 33 (6461 views)
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Re: [Koi Koi] Snail Pest [In reply to] Can't Post

Thanks Bro Koi Koi,
Will check out the mosquito screen.
But if I can really get hold o fthe Parasite Killer here in Singapore I would really want to try it if it does not have any side-effect on the koi.

Best Regards,
CH


cookcpu
User

Oct 7, 2009, 6:36 AM

Post #18 of 33 (6453 views)
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Re: [CH] Snail Pest [In reply to] Can't Post

Just to share my opinion on getting rid of midget.

When my pond is new, the filter chamber is fill with coral chip/cockle shell as bio material. Even when changing water every week, there is still midget around.

So after reading through this forum, I try to buy medicine on getting rid of midget. But the midget is still around.

Later I decided to change the coral chip/cockle shell (it is tough work to clean each bag of coral chip/cockle shell) to Jmatt and Bacterial house and bio ball. But the midget still around. Then I realise that all the bio chamber always have dirt around half inch thick on the bottom of the chamber.

I decided to clean all of this away by using pond vacuum or through other mean to get rid of it when pond vacuum are not available every week or twice a week and also try to clean the bio materials every 3 month.

As of this date, the midget is under control. There are still a few of them around but nothing to worry about. Just my 2 yen.


CH
User

Oct 7, 2009, 7:43 AM

Post #19 of 33 (6441 views)
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Re: [cookcpu] Snail Pest [In reply to] Can't Post

Dear Bro Cookcpu,
Thank you so much for sharing your experience.
Will changing all the cockle shell (I only have cockle & oyster shell) cause any problem with maintaining my pH?
Can you recommend a good pond vacuum? I presume you remove your J-mat when u do yr vacuuming every week or two, do you? Was told not to touch the bio-media chambers by the person servicing my pond (just backflush those chambers will do but everytime I backflush I don't see the thick layer of dirt draining out. But I am sure they are in there, so maybe backflushing can't really get rid of the layer of dirt). So, always caught in this predicament because of conflicting info, clean -worry disturb the benefitial bacteria, don't clean - midges, disease..

Other than getting rid of the midges, do you see any benefits to the koi?

Sry for the endless questions.

Best Regards,
CH


cookcpu
User

Oct 7, 2009, 9:17 AM

Post #20 of 33 (6431 views)
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Re: [CH] Snail Pest [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
Hello Bro CH,
I still have a few bag of oyster shell in my external FGT which is easier to clean so far I didn't experience any pH crash. Do note, my tap water pH is around 9.0.

I am using pondovac 3 by Oase (spoil already, long story Smile) and there is another brand of pond vacuum (bladgon I think)which is on display in Mainland.

I don't remove the J-mat or clean it, I just stick the vacuum tube into the transfer port and suck out all those dirt that lay at the bottom of the bio chamber. Every month the pond guy will clean my bio material in my bio chamber. Back flushing do help in getting rid of those dirt in the bottom drain pipe and settlement chamber. Whenever the bio material have been clean, the service guy always get the bio-bact from me to add to the bio-chamber in order to culture the bacteria grow.

The koi seem to be much happy and swim more often but if I get lazy or busy with work and I didn't do that for a month....then some how the koi started to flash. The main thing is to keep the water healthy which I am still in the learning stage, so that the koi will grow and stay healthy. Smile

How to tell the pond water is healthy, well, I feel it with my hand. I use to have bad pond water, whenever I touch it, it bite my hand or my hand feel very itchy. BlushLaugh

I am glad to share my experience with you or anyone after all, I have learn a lot about keeping a healthy pond and koi keeping from this forum.

Cheers,
Cookcpu


In Reply To
Dear Bro Cookcpu,
Thank you so much for sharing your experience.
Will changing all the cockle shell (I only have cockle & oyster shell) cause any problem with maintaining my pH?
Can you recommend a good pond vacuum? I presume you remove your J-mat when u do yr vacuuming every week or two, do you? Was told not to touch the bio-media chambers by the person servicing my pond (just backflush those chambers will do but everytime I backflush I don't see the thick layer of dirt draining out. But I am sure they are in there, so maybe backflushing can't really get rid of the layer of dirt). So, always caught in this predicament because of conflicting info, clean -worry disturb the benefitial bacteria, don't clean - midges, disease..

Other than getting rid of the midges, do you see any benefits to the koi?

Sry for the endless questions.

Best Regards,
CH



KoiAnswers
Koi Kichi

Oct 7, 2009, 9:38 AM

Post #21 of 33 (6419 views)
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Re: [CH] Snail Pest [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
Dear Bro Cookcpu,
Thank you so much for sharing your experience.
Will changing all the cockle shell (I only have cockle & oyster shell) cause any problem with maintaining my pH?
Can you recommend a good pond vacuum? I presume you remove your J-mat when u do yr vacuuming every week or two, do you? Was told not to touch the bio-media chambers by the person servicing my pond (just backflush those chambers will do but everytime I backflush I don't see the thick layer of dirt draining out. But I am sure they are in there, so maybe backflushing can't really get rid of the layer of dirt). So, always caught in this predicament because of conflicting info, clean -worry disturb the benefitial bacteria, don't clean - midges, disease..

Other than getting rid of the midges, do you see any benefits to the koi?

Sry for the endless questions.

Best Regards,
CH



Hi CH,
I have done so many things and ways before the 'PARASITE KILLER'. Everything else seemed to fail except for this medication. Even with this medication, you have to do it once in 3 months, which is not bad really i.e. only apply 4 times a year. At the same time, it kills snails, lice, anchor worms, gill and body flukes, and other external parasites. This is a magic wand for me.......If you happen to be in KL, buzz me and I will bring you to Hua May to get the medication.

Regards,


CH
User

Oct 7, 2009, 9:56 AM

Post #22 of 33 (6411 views)
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Re: [cookcpu] Snail Pest [In reply to] Can't Post

Dear Bro Cookcpu.
Once again thank you for your valuable sharing.
Two final questions - promise Laugh
1. My service guy don't take out the bio material to clean, can you pm me who does yr servicing and what is included in yr service contract ?
2. What is the cost of your pond vacuum?

Cheers
CH


CH
User

Oct 7, 2009, 10:16 AM

Post #23 of 33 (6409 views)
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Re: [msms] Snail Pest [In reply to] Can't Post

Dear Bro Shukri,
Thank you so much for the offer, if I am in KL I would definitely jump at the chance to see your setup and learn from it (please forgive me if I am being too presumptuous).

If it is not too much bother, can you take a photo of "The Parasite Killer" so that I can also go scout around Singapore for it.

Thanks a million
CH


KoiAnswers
Koi Kichi

Oct 7, 2009, 10:43 AM

Post #24 of 33 (6404 views)
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Re: [CH] Snail Pest [In reply to] Can't Post

Dear CH,
No problem. If you can PM to me your hp number, I can MMS to you the picture of the 'PARASITE KILLER.'

Cheers,


raistlin
User

Oct 8, 2009, 2:08 AM

Post #25 of 33 (6373 views)
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Re: [CH] Snail Pest [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi CH,

The cockle/oyster shells act as a buffer to prevent pH crashes, so having NONE at all is not a good idea unless you use some other pH buffer additives.

Unless you have a fantastically designed and over-sized filter, I would say there would definitely be some level of sludge (dirt) in your filters. A good gauge is looking at the amount of sludge caking your jmats and other bio media. What you can see is probably only a small fraction of what is actually trapped in your filter. Actually if you ask for my opinion, midges are a good indication of how clean your filters are. If you open your filters and a cloud of them swarms out, you probably need to look at redesigning your filters or improving the maintenance. Midge babies (blood worms) feed on sludge and other rotting material, the more sludge (food) there is the more midges you will see. As we all know, sludge is not good. A lot of harmful bacteria thrives in sludge. You want as little in your system as possible, balanced by practicality of maintenance.

IHMO, you should always take 'professional advice' with a pinch of salt. I've heard this thing about not touching the filter media because all the good bacteria is inside. The professional also told me just backflushing weekly is good enough. I think a lot depends on your situation. If your filters are adequately sized for your bio-load and not caked in sludge, then that advice holds water. But I think many of us have over-stocked ponds and under-sized filters. When I used to blindly follow 'professional advice', my koi used to fall sick every now and then. I also had swarms of midges in my filters.

Then, I started reading forums and articles about koi keeping.

I have a tiny 5ton pond and a 2ton filter. I have 9 koi. I know I am overstocked and I cannot resist feeding them heavily. So I started developing my own maintenance schdule. I clean my first chamber weekly. I clean ALL chambers every 1-2 months depending on my feeding rate. I spray tap water through the mats and shells to dislodge most of the dirt. A lot of professionals and hobbyists will probably say I am crazy and killing my beneficial bacteria. Well, I have read about bacteria growth in koi filters and I believe that once the bacteria has colonized the filter, they are a lot more resilient than most people think. I used to religiously monitor water parameters before/after and in between all the cleaning. After I realised that my water parameters were ok and in fact improved after all this cleaning, I finally got lazy and only do occasional testing now. The cleaning is back-breaking, filthy and unpleasant. I could probably hire someone to do it but I think I would do it better and for free. Laugh I just take it as extra exercise now. Oh yeah, and I also try to do small water changes frequently. I still have a few midges around but at much lower levels and my koi have not been sick since (TOUCH WOOD!) Tongue.

I am not asking you to do what I do. Just saying to arm yourself with knowledge, observe your own situation, and make adjustments. Don't rely FULLY on professional advice. Remember that they might not be the best source of UNBIASED information. Only you yourself would have your own personal interests at heart 100%. Do not be mistaken that I am blasting all the professionals, I have had good experiences too with some like Max, NKF and mainland.

I think you answered your own question about whether you should clean your filters. Don't clean = midges, disease. I'm sorry but to me, if someone tells me to keep the sludge in my filters, I'd think its a load of BS! Wink

Happy Koi-keeping!
Raistlin


In Reply To
Dear Bro Cookcpu,
Thank you so much for sharing your experience.
Will changing all the cockle shell (I only have cockle & oyster shell) cause any problem with maintaining my pH?
Can you recommend a good pond vacuum? I presume you remove your J-mat when u do yr vacuuming every week or two, do you? Was told not to touch the bio-media chambers by the person servicing my pond (just backflush those chambers will do but everytime I backflush I don't see the thick layer of dirt draining out. But I am sure they are in there, so maybe backflushing can't really get rid of the layer of dirt). So, always caught in this predicament because of conflicting info, clean -worry disturb the benefitial bacteria, don't clean - midges, disease..

Other than getting rid of the midges, do you see any benefits to the koi?

Sry for the endless questions.

Best Regards,
CH


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