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Preparing a new pond with good water quality.

 




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kianliang87
Novice

Jun 6, 2009, 12:38 PM

Post #1 of 15 (7581 views)
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Preparing a new pond with good water quality. Can't Post

Hi,
I'm a newbie in KOI hobby and also new to this forum. I have some questions about preparing a new pond with good water quality.

First of all, the newly built pond is a concrete pond which will leech large amount of high PH right?
So my question is, how do we cycle this tank until the PH stabilize to a level which it will not harm the KOI?

I've seen few different methods, vinegar, pineapple, acid. Can anyone tell me what is the advantages and disadvantages of the methods? As far as i know acid is the cheapest method and has the lowest PH comparing to the rest. But i'm not sure if it is safe. Please help.
Wink
-Kian Liang-
-4th year Engineering Student-


harryluhur
User


Jun 10, 2009, 7:44 PM

Post #2 of 15 (7472 views)
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Re: [kianliang87] Preparing a new pond with good water quality. [In reply to] Can't Post

You may also use banana tree, it most effective and free.

---------------------------------------
Harry Luhur
36 AQUATIC - Indonesia
Professional Pond Builder and Consultant



kianliang87
Novice

Jun 15, 2009, 1:34 PM

Post #3 of 15 (7380 views)
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Re: [harryluhur] Preparing a new pond with good water quality. [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
You may also use banana tree, it most effective and free.

-Kian Liang-
-4th year Engineering Student-


KoiAnswers
Koi Kichi

Jun 15, 2009, 7:55 PM

Post #4 of 15 (7350 views)
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Re: [kianliang87] Preparing a new pond with good water quality. [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
Hi,
I'm a newbie in KOI hobby and also new to this forum. I have some questions about preparing a new pond with good water quality.

First of all, the newly built pond is a concrete pond which will leech large amount of high PH right?
So my question is, how do we cycle this tank until the PH stabilize to a level which it will not harm the KOI?

I've seen few different methods, vinegar, pineapple, acid. Can anyone tell me what is the advantages and disadvantages of the methods? As far as i know acid is the cheapest method and has the lowest PH comparing to the rest. But i'm not sure if it is safe. Please help.
Wink


Hi there,
The first and formost is to be patient. Often than not, people (me included when I first got started) will always rush in things, and before we realized what's happening, the Kois are in the pond and 1001 problems will occur. So let's start from the beginning, yes you are correct that a freshly made concrete pond will cause the pH to be high i.e. very alkaline. Also the toxic stuff that are in the cement are also lethal to the kois. You would want to get rid of these first! Yes, go ahead and buy enough pineapples and start to rub them on the surfaces of your pond. Sure, it is cumbersome but this will be good for your pond going forward. The banana trunks chop up in chunks will be OK too after this i.e. soak it when you put in your water in the pond. Another alternative is to get rice vinegar (these are very cheap actually), well as a yard stick, one bottle per ton/2 ton of water. Let it sit for 3 to 5 days or even 7 days. This will do wonders to your pond.....thrust me on this! After that drained all of the water, host down the pond surface and clean thoroughly! Then fill your pond with water. This next step is entirely my own and it is up to you to follow or not! It is up to you! Most new pond has a lot of parasites and bacterias that are unknown to us. Not treating this will eventually affect the new introduce kois one way of the other. At this point I would bomb the pond with PP (Potassium Permanganate) at a rate of 3mg per ton of water. Let the water sits for 6 to 8 hours, give it a further 2 additional hours, add at least 0.3% salt to the pond. My recommendation is 0.6% salt. By doing the PP and the salt, it will take care of most of the parasites and the bacterias. At this time I do not wish to be very technical as this will further create confusion. I recommend that after a further 3 - 5 days, drop the water by 50% and top up with fresh water from the tap. Don't forget to put anti chlorine and water conditioner at this point. Give yourself 24 hours, and check the water parameters i.e. pH, Ammonia, Nitrite, Nitrate and kH. The reading at this point should be within acceptable range. Then get one or two local kois (you need to ensure that these are being quarantine already) and put them into the pond. Watch the behavior and on the third day, feed these two fishes sparringly! Just feed a little bit only! You only need a little feaces and waste products to jump start your filter. This is also the right time to introduce nitrosomonas and nitrobacter into your biological filter........At this stage and when you introduce the Nishikigoi, you would want to check the water parameters as frequent as you can.
Hope this helps! CoolCoolCoolCoolCool

Regards,
msms


harryluhur
User


Jun 16, 2009, 8:06 PM

Post #5 of 15 (7306 views)
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Re: [msms] Preparing a new pond with good water quality. [In reply to] Can't Post

Nice work bro.
a setup method by uncle Davidsoon also very nice to read.
I agree with you msms, most new hobbyist rush on everything. I came to a few occasion like this.
After setup a new pond, when everything ready, i usually put a few fish to testdrive the pond and start the bacteria.
In few occasions, in a few days, my start fish (usually the healthy but cheap ugly fish) is already thrown away, and the owner puts a lot, i mean A LOT of new fish..... throw a lot of food..... what a headache......
Pls don't laugh, it is a lesson for all new hobbyist. If you start from zero, building the pond until you can put the fish is at least 1-1,5month (concentre pond), fiber pond is shorter period 20-30days. All depend on your pond size n contructions periods. Please be patient, better slowly than srorrly (sorry).

---------------------------------------
Harry Luhur
36 AQUATIC - Indonesia
Professional Pond Builder and Consultant


kianliang87
Novice

Jun 17, 2009, 8:42 PM

Post #6 of 15 (7253 views)
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Re: [msms] Preparing a new pond with good water quality. [In reply to] Can't Post

Thanks for the feed back guys. A question about rubbing the pineapple to the walls of the concrete pond. After rubbing the pineapples. Do we need to fill up the pond or just leave it with the pineapple skin and juice only without adding any water?
-Kian Liang-
-4th year Engineering Student-


kianliang87
Novice

Jun 18, 2009, 2:06 PM

Post #7 of 15 (7214 views)
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Re: [msms] Preparing a new pond with good water quality. [In reply to] Can't Post

What about the banana trunk. It is dried ones or living ones?
-Kian Liang-
-4th year Engineering Student-


harryluhur
User


Jun 18, 2009, 2:15 PM

Post #8 of 15 (7210 views)
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Re: [kianliang87] Preparing a new pond with good water quality. [In reply to] Can't Post

Dear Kian Liang,
We use the living ones. chop it and just put in the the pond for 2-3 days, take it out, drain all the water while cleaning the pond wall. And then introduce new water and cycle it for 2-3 days before put a few pcs fish and bacteria starter to start the pond.

---------------------------------------
Harry Luhur
36 AQUATIC - Indonesia
Professional Pond Builder and Consultant


kianliang87
Novice

Jun 18, 2009, 5:05 PM

Post #9 of 15 (7196 views)
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Re: [harryluhur] Preparing a new pond with good water quality. [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Harryluhur,
Thanks alot for your answer. I will try it by next week. Previously the tank was soak with water + asid(about 1 week now), but the asid doesn't seem to be strong enough for the very high PH. Just after few hours adding the asid, water turns Alkaline again. Now i'm wondering if pineapple can do the job. I know pineapple is asidic, but shouldn't be as asidic as asid i think. Well, now let's hope for banana to do the job. However, i'll still try to do both ways. Banana and pineapple both of them. Since i have more than 1 pond. Thanks again for reply guys. Any more comment or advice is highly appreciated. I'm just a newbie.
-Kian Liang-
-4th year Engineering Student-


harryluhur
User


Jun 18, 2009, 6:01 PM

Post #10 of 15 (7186 views)
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Re: [kianliang87] Preparing a new pond with good water quality. [In reply to] Can't Post

Thanks alot for your answer. I will try it by next week. Previously the tank was soak with water + asid(about 1 week now), but the asid doesn't seem to be strong enough for the very high PH. Just after few hours adding the asid, water turns Alkaline again.

Dear Kian Liang, i am bit confuse with your reply ? Are you asking this few method to eliminate alkali in concentrate or you are trying to lowering your pond pH? What is your source water pH? pH from your source water usually rise after aeration in few hours.

---------------------------------------
Harry Luhur
36 AQUATIC - Indonesia
Professional Pond Builder and Consultant


kianliang87
Novice

Jun 18, 2009, 8:26 PM

Post #11 of 15 (7170 views)
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Re: [harryluhur] Preparing a new pond with good water quality. [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi,
I'm sorry for the confusion here.
Actually the pond is already soaking with water. Direct tap water is about neutral. Just after a few hours, the water turns very high alkaline. Maximum for my test kit is about 8.6(i'm not sure) since the colour is at the max alkaline my test kit can test. I assume it might be even higher alkaline.
So, i added asid to the pond. Immediately after a while, the water turns asidic but only for a short period before it turns to maximum alkaline again. I think this is because the pond leeches high PH all the time.

So, my concern would be the method to eliminate the alkaline in the pond until it does not leeches alkaline anymore, or reaches a stable PH where it won't fluctuate anymore. Should i keep treating it with asid? Until it doesn't leech alkaline anymore before i can start eliminating the bad bacterias and grow benefcial bacterias. Because i have a feeling that, treating with pineapple would not completely stablelize the leeching alkalines.

Maybe it is because the pond is not coated with anything. It is finished with cement for all the walls inside and outside.
-Kian Liang-
-4th year Engineering Student-


harryluhur
User


Jun 19, 2009, 7:42 PM

Post #12 of 15 (7102 views)
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Re: [kianliang87] Preparing a new pond with good water quality. [In reply to] Can't Post

Dear Kian Liang,

Try to used a digital pH tester, there is a few brand with friendly price for hobbyist pocket.
You may also check your KH (you may use strip test kit). Usually water with lower buffering capacity tend to fluctuate after aeration. You may also try to use a bucket of your water, put an aeration, and do a testing.

Note. Pls read the test kit about matching the color. Different brand have different method. Tetra test is sideview with the color chart. Sera test kit have to match the color from above, both method have to be used under natural sunlight (not in direct sunlight). If you use sera test kit, and compare to chart in side view, sometime the color can match 1-2 level above the actual color.

---------------------------------------
Harry Luhur
36 AQUATIC - Indonesia
Professional Pond Builder and Consultant


KoiAnswers
Koi Kichi

Jun 22, 2009, 12:31 PM

Post #13 of 15 (7012 views)
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Re: [kianliang87] Preparing a new pond with good water quality. [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi there,
If you would have followed my advice with the pineapple, then the life banana tree trunk plus the rice vinegar, your pond would not have the readings that you have said! Even a pH 8.6 eventhough a bit high, will not kill your koi, but the toxicity from the cement will! I have a friend that have as high as pH 9 but didnt kill his fish, but at this high a pH with intolerable Ammonia level will kill your fish for sure! I hope your contractor did not add lime to the cement when putting the walls and floor of your pond. If he did, then you would have to wait for a longer time before introducing your fish!

Be patient and keep doing as suggested a few rounds and your pond will be ready......

Regards,
msms


QQberryQQ
New User

Aug 24, 2009, 4:07 AM

Post #14 of 15 (6540 views)
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Re: [msms] Preparing a new pond with good water quality. [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi there! I'm new here. Nice to meet you all!
Actually i have a new pond around 6ft x 9ft with the water depth of 2 ft. I have oled put in the banana trunk for 4 days but the water pH still higher than 8 so should i put in the vinegar?


KoiAnswers
Koi Kichi

Aug 24, 2009, 7:24 AM

Post #15 of 15 (6520 views)
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Re: [QQberryQQ] Preparing a new pond with good water quality. [In reply to] Can't Post

Yes, please put in the rice vinegar in there and let it soaked for a few days! This will neutralize the cement and the related toxic things that are in the cement. Also, please check the pH of your water source so as to compare the pH of the pond water and the water source.

Regards,

 
 
 



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