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concrete vs brick vs liner

 






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koi@kit
Senior Member


May 22, 2006, 10:08 PM

Post #1 of 31 (1133 views)
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concrete vs brick vs liner Can't Post

hi all..

assuming u r making a pond of 30ft long, 12ft wide and 8ft deep pond...about 80ton pond..

which material will u use.. concrete? liner? or bricks? please also state ur reason.. many tks for ur feedback..Smile


Koi38
Senior Member


May 23, 2006, 6:57 AM

Post #2 of 31 (1120 views)
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Re: [koi@kit] concrete vs brick vs liner [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Kit,

What kind of pond are we talking about, semi above ground, below ground, formal or informalCrazy

rgds,
Jon

"DuKu Friendly"
_____________________________________
"No one is ever too old to know better"

http://s3.photobucket.com/albums/y63/Koi38/


koi@kit
Senior Member


May 23, 2006, 8:48 AM

Post #3 of 31 (1116 views)
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Re: [Koi38] concrete vs brick vs liner [In reply to] Can't Post

hi master cifu..

assuming the pond is 2ft above ground.. rectangular shape pond..Smile


Koi38
Senior Member


May 23, 2006, 10:13 AM

Post #4 of 31 (1108 views)
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Re: [koi@kit] concrete vs brick vs liner [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Kit,

If I to build this pond I'll use concrete then fiberglass. It may be expensive using FG but at least leaking is highly unlikely when done properly, aslo easy to repair if need beWink If FG is out of the question then I'll still use concrete then use thick preformed liner. Again it will be pricey but no wrinklesSmile The only thing I don't like with liners is when once it leak it a little hard to findPirate

rgds,
Jon

PS: Are you about to build a new pond Kit???

"DuKu Friendly"
_____________________________________
"No one is ever too old to know better"

http://s3.photobucket.com/albums/y63/Koi38/

(This post was edited by Koi38 on May 23, 2006, 10:40 AM)


Scotto
Koi Lover


May 23, 2006, 11:49 AM

Post #5 of 31 (1098 views)
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Re: [koi@kit] concrete vs brick vs liner [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi cifu kit,

That is a big pond! In my amatuer opinion, I will use high grade concrete and aprropriate waterproving as it is less likely to leak and will last for a long time. Bricks are likely to have cracks after a while and thus will leak, have no experience with liners thus will not comment.

The down side with concrete is cost, with the high price of steel and cement in Brunei now, will cost you a lot to build one of this size UnsurePirate

cheers!
scott


koi@kit
Senior Member


May 23, 2006, 1:15 PM

Post #6 of 31 (1086 views)
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Re: [Scotto] concrete vs brick vs liner [In reply to] Can't Post

hi scott..

my question for u wud be... u think liner will last longer than concrete? by how long in ur own opinion.. i know concrete is the best. but as u have said. the cost is super high nowadays..Pirate

cheers


koi@kit
Senior Member


May 23, 2006, 1:18 PM

Post #7 of 31 (1085 views)
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Re: [Koi38] concrete vs brick vs liner [In reply to] Can't Post

master cifu...

a new pond??? yes.. in my mind.. hehehehheh.. but make sure not making the same mistake as before.. PLANNING..

i m planning to make a 80 to 100 ton pond..Sly


Scotto
Koi Lover


May 23, 2006, 2:49 PM

Post #8 of 31 (1076 views)
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Re: [koi@kit] concrete vs brick vs liner [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi cifu kit,

I know nuts about linersBlush, so am not able to answer your question. One thing always on my mind is that, can liners be joined together if it is not big enough to cover the base and the sides of the pond? Another is how to construct a submerged filter with liners? I suppose there are special seals to make the holes created water tight?

Cheers!
scott


Robert Lee
Koi Lover


May 23, 2006, 3:02 PM

Post #9 of 31 (1076 views)
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Re: [koi@kit] concrete vs brick vs liner [In reply to] Can't Post

Cifu,

Big one you are planning to build. Based on experience concrete is better then bricks and liner is economical but in Brunei the widest liner you can get is 8m.
Therefore you 12ft width by 8ft depth will be in excess ( 12+8+8+6(apron) ) will work out to be 10.36m width. There may be liner wider than that I do not know.
HDPE liner should be lasting and infact this is the material that are use for treatment ponds.


Best regards


koi@kit
Senior Member


May 23, 2006, 3:47 PM

Post #10 of 31 (1069 views)
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Re: [Scotto] concrete vs brick vs liner [In reply to] Can't Post

hi scott..

not sure if liner can be join.. might get leak after some time if join.. yap u r rite, i also dont know how to construct a submerge filter.. i guess the best is to pump feed to BH.. what do u think??

cheers..Sly


koi@kit
Senior Member


May 23, 2006, 3:54 PM

Post #11 of 31 (1068 views)
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Re: [Robert Lee] concrete vs brick vs liner [In reply to] Can't Post

hi Robert..

went to petlink Delima, the widest liner they have is 6ft not 6meter.. i dont know if its the one u mentioned.. $7 per meter.

from scott's question, do u think i can connect the liner? if cannot be connected my new pond will ly be 3ft deepUnsure..

btw, how u make ur potato treats for ur koi? how u mix scott emulsions in them? may be yogurt can replace emulsions..
what do u think?

rgds
kit


Koi38
Senior Member


May 23, 2006, 4:19 PM

Post #12 of 31 (1060 views)
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Re: [koi@kit] concrete vs brick vs liner [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Kit,

Liner can be joined so you can have 30m long x 30m wide if you want or a LOT widerWink There is pond here that used liner and yes its 470 TonShockedShockedShocked They used some special tape for liners. Have a look for yourselfSmile

rgds,
Jon




"DuKu Friendly"
_____________________________________
"No one is ever too old to know better"

http://s3.photobucket.com/albums/y63/Koi38/


Robert Lee
Koi Lover


May 23, 2006, 4:20 PM

Post #13 of 31 (1060 views)
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Re: [koi@kit] concrete vs brick vs liner [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Kit,

yes there are 8m width liner at B$11.70 per m.

The kois go crazy with the potatoes and we feed them twice a week and it does cloud the water a fair bit.
You should go to petlink or petvision at kuilap.They have the 6m and 8m liner.


Best regards


sunshinekoi
Member


May 23, 2006, 6:46 PM

Post #14 of 31 (1047 views)
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Re: [koi@kit] concrete vs brick vs liner [In reply to] Can't Post

Kit,
If it is a rectangle shape and have a upstand of 2ft, then definitely a concrete pond n FB is recommended as by koi38.Laugh Liner need to lay on something solids in order to be effective. Liner cannot do 90degree wall too and it will get tear up if that is the case due to directional stress. Not unless you have a concrete wall behind the linerLaugh You can do liner without concrete but will not have the 2ft upstand. Liner normally lays on gradual slope, so that mean if you want to have 8ft deep with 80 tons water. A lot of surface area will be taken up but scenery will be much aestestic thoughCool

If you have some sorts of layout for the pond design, I would suggest you to check with contractors, ask their opinion on costs. That way will cut down a lot of your puzzle, questions and times, $$$.Tongue


koi@kit
Senior Member


May 23, 2006, 7:51 PM

Post #15 of 31 (1046 views)
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Re: [Koi38] concrete vs brick vs liner [In reply to] Can't Post

hi master cifu..

dats a hugh pond!!!!!SlyLaugh...

i have check in Brunei theres a shop who can do 'weldable' liner... they can connect n shape what ever i want.. the price.. about B$7 per 1sq feet..Unsure..

rgds
kit


koi@kit
Senior Member


May 23, 2006, 7:52 PM

Post #16 of 31 (1045 views)
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Re: [Robert Lee] concrete vs brick vs liner [In reply to] Can't Post

hi robert..

many thanks for the info.. we go petvision to check it out 2moro..

how do u prepare ur potato? how u mix the scotts emulsion?

rgds
kit


koi@kit
Senior Member


May 23, 2006, 7:55 PM

Post #17 of 31 (1044 views)
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Re: [sunshinekoi] concrete vs brick vs liner [In reply to] Can't Post

hi sunshine..

u r rite... more logic... surely will get a contractor to check the price.. but now i need to know more about liner, dont think any contractor know about liner..

btw.. i accidentally deleted ur PM just now.. can u resent?Sly

rgds
kit


sunshinekoi
Member


May 23, 2006, 8:13 PM

Post #18 of 31 (1038 views)
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Re: [koi@kit] concrete vs brick vs liner [In reply to] Can't Post

Binding liner is just a matter of good skill and patient which I have not seen a good one over here yet. I would rather advise you built a swimming pool style than country side view because the latter will not satisfy your 8ft deep criteria unless you want to built a basement with glass. hhahahahahaShocked bottom view instead???Tongue
You want it deep and country side scenery, need a lake man!! hahahahahSly


Robert Lee
Koi Lover


May 23, 2006, 9:06 PM

Post #19 of 31 (1034 views)
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Re: [koi@kit] concrete vs brick vs liner [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Kit,

We mixed the potatoes with scott emulsion ( orange flavour )Sly
first we steam the potatoes them mesh it then mix with scott emulsion.


Scotto
Koi Lover


May 23, 2006, 9:31 PM

Post #20 of 31 (1029 views)
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Re: [koi@kit] concrete vs brick vs liner [In reply to] Can't Post

hi cifu kit,

Ya, pump feed to BS/BH is a good option; Another option is, I have read in articles they have bottom drain designed for liner, where it has an additional ring to screw on top of the liner to seal it, then you can build a seperate brick/concrete filter somewhere; in this way, your filter can be shallower, say 3-4ft deep, thus you save in concrete/bricks. But will have to mail order in the bottom drain. They also have to lay some kind of underlay to prevent sharp objects from piercing the liner.

Robert is definitely a liner guy, he made a nice pond with it at a fraction of the cost of concrete pond, must learn from him.Smile


Robert Lee
Koi Lover


May 23, 2006, 10:15 PM

Post #21 of 31 (1017 views)
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Re: [Scotto] concrete vs brick vs liner [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Scotto,

I built my pond with 2,700 pieces of bricks = B$ 370.00 ( pond size 3m x 7m )
10m of liners = B$70.00
Pumps ( 7 all together- long Story ) = B$500.00
Fishes ( all except 2 ) givenWink
All accessories are either from the store (old stock)
fliter - air hsndling unit fliters so far the best compared to some of those I brought.
Bio balls ( givenWink)

And with the help from Cifu kit and you the water condition is getting better
PH is 8-8.5 constant now.
Salt is at 0.17
Ammonia still at 0.4mg/l not matter what I do


Scotto
Koi Lover


May 23, 2006, 10:25 PM

Post #22 of 31 (1016 views)
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Re: [Robert Lee] concrete vs brick vs liner [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Robert,

B$440 for the pond!! Cheaper then a small fibreglass tank!Laugh Respect man! Must go and see your pond one day..

Your AHU filters definitely won't get rid of ammoniaTongueSly, have you tried putting bacteria culture into your filter to speed up bacteria growth?

Cheers!
scott


koi@kit
Senior Member


May 23, 2006, 10:29 PM

Post #23 of 31 (1013 views)
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Re: [sunshinekoi] concrete vs brick vs liner [In reply to] Can't Post

sunshine..

i like ur ideas.. but i think i will stick to concrete.. safety 1st.. think long term..Sly


koi@kit
Senior Member


May 23, 2006, 10:39 PM

Post #24 of 31 (1011 views)
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Re: [Robert Lee] concrete vs brick vs liner [In reply to] Can't Post

hi robert..
u mix the mesh potato with emulsions? wont the mixture split after touched the water?

to reduce ur ammonia u need to put more media which is the 'house' for bacteria to grow on.. u can get media made from rock or plastic..

cheers..


koi@kit
Senior Member


May 23, 2006, 10:42 PM

Post #25 of 31 (1010 views)
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Re: [Scotto] concrete vs brick vs liner [In reply to] Can't Post

hi scott..

advice taken.. have seen those BD before.. tks..

u r rite, robert is surely the liner guy to learn from.. btw, u havent see his other DIY.. they will shock u..Sly

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