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New koi buying...

 





 


monscine
Koi Lover


May 25, 2005, 10:04 PM

Post #1 of 12 (1461 views)
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New koi buying... Can't Post
I've bought a tancho koi as 61 cm length. I've released it 4 days ago in my house pond. For the first 2 days nothing was real matter, until i found it just lays down at the bottom of the pond from the 3rd day until now and making no response when i'm feeding my koi's Frown. Its fin is closing and she just make several movements while laying down. Is she under stress or may in unhealthy condition Crazy ? Anybody could give advices or experiences to my case? Thank-you very much.


GCSpyder
Koi Addict


May 25, 2005, 10:10 PM

Post #2 of 12 (1451 views)
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Re: [monscine] New koi buying... [In reply to] Can't Post
Hi Monscine,

Any koi that is lying at the bottom with fins closed is definitely not feeling well, but the cause of it could be many.

Is yours an established pond or is it a new one? Can you share more information at all? It is easier for us to help if more information is available to us. Eg, water parameters, details of pond including capacity, current stocking level etc. Just give us what you have at the moment and we can see what to make of it.

Cheers..


monscine
Koi Lover


May 25, 2005, 11:32 PM

Post #3 of 12 (1446 views)
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Re: [GCSpyder] New koi buying... [In reply to] Can't Post
Hi, GCSpyder. I am a new comer to koi's world. Yes, the pond was the new one with about 4m length, 3m width, and 1,5m depth. Before I bought this tancho, firstly I've released 5 koi's of 15 cm length around 10 days ago. Then I bought again 13 koi's 5 days ago which sizes 15-25 cm. The last one I put was that tancho and a platinum koi. I'm using OASE Filter type BioTec 18, an OASE UV Bitron 36, and 3 column of mechanical filtering system aside the pond.

I think as what you think. And probably tomorrow I would separate her from the others for having treatments.


neutokoi
Koi Lover

May 26, 2005, 9:17 AM

Post #4 of 12 (1437 views)
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Re: [monscine] New koi buying... [In reply to] Can't Post
Hi Monscine,
Wlcom to the Koi world, hope you will enjoy this hobby as much as we are.
Looking at the speed of you adding so many kois in your new pond, I am worried that you are going to repeat the same mistake that I have done before, you may refer to another thread "stupidest thing you have ever done" in the General discussion topic.
http://www.koi.com.my/cgi-bin/koiforum/gforum.cgi?post=53103;sb=post_latest_reply;so=ASC;forum_view=forum_view_collapsed;;page=unread#unread

If you've done similar thing as I did, pls start to check the water parameter/quality. Search also in this forum for threads about new pond and water quality, I forget the title of the thread. Hope this will help.

Rgds,
Edo


GCSpyder
Koi Addict


May 26, 2005, 12:48 PM

Post #5 of 12 (1417 views)
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Re: [monscine] New koi buying... [In reply to] Can't Post
hi Monscine,

Edo has directed you to a good place for you to learn about your pond. I suspect that your pond is going through a new pond syndrom at this moment. Of course, introducing kois from multiple sources could also introduce the element of parasites/bacteria diseases to the pond.

I would suggest that you try to eliminate water quality issues as the first step. Test for Ammonia, nitrite and to a lesser extent nitrate. You will know that the pond has not cycled if ammonia and nitrite is tested positive in your pond.

If you confirm that the pond has not cycled, I would suggest that you limit feeding to a few pellets a day. The koi will not die at this feeding regime for a few weeks. If there is nitrite, you should salt your pond (between 0.3-0.5%). That would require 54kg-90kg of salt. If you are salting to that level, I would suggest doing it over 3 days.

If it is parasite, I would isolate the koi for treatment. If it is due to water quality, I would normally leave the tancho with the rest.

For your consideration

Cheers..


monscine
Koi Lover


May 27, 2005, 1:25 AM

Post #6 of 12 (1384 views)
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Re: [neutokoi] New koi buying... [In reply to] Can't Post
Hi Edo & Syder,

Thanks for welcoming me. And yes I really enjoy the hobby cause I can the fishes and I can jump to the pond and swim together with them Sly ...hahaha.
As I was a discus fish breeder before, I have a little understanding that the pond would need filtration system to go first before jumping the fish into the pond. So, I filled up the pond, ran the pumping machines, let the water circulated for about 2 weeks. And after that I bought the koi's. The first 5 koi's were intended to make biological filter runs. And then I bought some more koi's. What I'm worry is that the tancho doesn't like to jogging like the others and just put herself on the corner and just sit there. Since I'm new to this koi hobby, I still don't understand the fish psycho related to the pond, water quality, and so on. The last check on water quality was the ammonia level rather high as shown 1,5mg/l. And the water quite smelly. pH is at 7,6. Nitrate level is low. Today I pumped out 20% of water level and filled up the pond with tap water again. I thought the filtration systems hadn't work well yet.

Last thing was that one of my koi's laid eggs and the water became cloudy. I asked my friend that it would make ammonia level going up and some fishes would feel their body scrathcy. So that's why I did pump the water out.

I can see the tancho body looks pink as it should be white because of the blood stream thought its small vessel. Should this a sign of stress or what? And yes spyder, I would do salting the water tomorrow and give them just a bit bite as I just knew that my house people ofter feeding them while I wasn't at home. Thank-you very much for both of you for having me advices.

Btw, anyone know where could I buy a shiro bekko + Chagoi at Jakarta?

Regards


GCSpyder
Koi Addict


May 27, 2005, 10:11 AM

Post #7 of 12 (1368 views)
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Re: [monscine] New koi buying... [In reply to] Can't Post
Hi Monscine,

Tanchos and shiros are like canary of the pond. They seems to be almost among the first to show signs of stress. The spidery web veins that you saw are a definite sign of stress and you have more or less confirm that the cause of it is ammonia.

With that level of ambient ammonia, we have to assume that nitrite level can be quite high too. Better check for this too.

High level of ammonia, water smelly, koi spawning plus the last straw was your presence IN the pond Shocked. You must have been the major contributor of ammonia! Sly Good luck. Good to carry on with water change and salt to 0.3% in the meantime.

Cheers..


neutokoi
Koi Lover

May 27, 2005, 2:30 PM

Post #8 of 12 (1355 views)
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Re: [monscine] New koi buying... [In reply to] Can't Post
In Reply To

I can see the tancho body looks pink as it should be white because of the blood stream thought its small vessel.
Btw, anyone know where could I buy a shiro bekko + Chagoi at Jakarta?

Regards
Agree with Syder that the pink blood vessel is due to stress, you may need to stop feeding for a day or two, and don't forget to salt the pond or the quarantine tank.

Talking about where to buy bekko & Chagoi, as those fish is not as common as kohaku & Sanke, you need some luck, I recommend you to visit koi shop more often or leave you mobile number with them, so that they will inform you when the have the type of koi that you want. If you play with imported koi, you can go to Nirwana, Golden, Kasa koi, I heard that there is one in Sunter, and alot other, I believe other forum members can recommend a lot of places to you. If you are looking for local bred, then Kartini, Sumenep, Barito and Kelapa Gading will be the place to go

Cheers,
Edo


monscine
Koi Lover


May 27, 2005, 7:03 PM

Post #9 of 12 (1340 views)
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Re: [GCSpyder] New koi buying... [In reply to] Can't Post
Today I woke up and went to the pond, huhuuuyyy how lovely the tancho is driving on the road again with her red hat Cool though she hasn't want to eat any yet ... I bet I pee too much on the pond and made that ammonia getting high Angelic And you were right, since the ammonia level that high, I found the nitrite level also high too. Well, thx again as you give me a point of view to my case. I just know that two species are the sentimental one and need extra treatment.

And thanks for your info Edo. I got the contact number of jap koi's importers from this forum. I might hunt them down by tomorrow...hope can get one. But I still have problems pumping out the water from the last filter chamber. The pump I bought is not powerful enough as it's only 54 ltr/min. And this make the filter flow isn't good enough. Which one you guys using? The submerse one or the common one?


GCSpyder
Koi Addict


May 27, 2005, 7:33 PM

Post #10 of 12 (1334 views)
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Re: [monscine] New koi buying... [In reply to] Can't Post
Hi Monscine,

With Nitrite high, you should consider salting to about 0.3% to offset the toxic effect of nitrite or you will other problems soon. Good to know that we have identified the problem. I know it is difficult as we get older, but you got to hold that bladder Laugh

cheers..


monscine
Koi Lover


May 28, 2005, 5:11 AM

Post #11 of 12 (1320 views)
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Re: [GCSpyder] New koi buying... [In reply to] Can't Post
Indeed salting would be needed, but at the other side I am worry that the salt would effect algae on the pond bottom line. Doesn't the pond need the algae to process nitrite since I don't put any plans on it?


GCSpyder
Koi Addict


May 28, 2005, 9:36 AM

Post #12 of 12 (1318 views)
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Re: [monscine] New koi buying... [In reply to] Can't Post
Hi Monscine,

As your pond is not yet cycled, it is more important to make sure that you have that level of salt to reduce the toxicity effect of nitrite. Once it is cycled, you can remove the salt level through successive water changes.

Don't worry so much about affecting the algae at the moment. They are very resilient and will come back very quickly though I doubt if it can be affected at that level of salt

cheers..

 
 
 



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